{"id":817,"date":"2009-03-08T23:22:05","date_gmt":"2009-03-08T23:22:05","guid":{"rendered":"http:\/\/www.slatur.is\/?p=817"},"modified":"2011-05-15T23:25:13","modified_gmt":"2011-05-15T23:25:13","slug":"tungumalupplysingar-og-skynjun","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/www.slatur.is\/?p=817","title":{"rendered":"Tungum\u00e1l\/uppl\u00fdsingar og skynjun"},"content":{"rendered":"<div id=\"nabble\">\n<div>\n<div><a href=\"http:\/\/s-l-a-t-u-r.2169095.n2.nabble.com\/\">S.L.\u00c1.T.U.R.<\/a><\/div>\n<div><a href=\"http:\/\/s-l-a-t-u-r.2169095.n2.nabble.com\/template\/NamlServlet.jtp?macro=login_page&amp;nextUrl=http%3A%2F%2Fs-l-a-t-u-r.2169095.n2.nabble.com%2FTungumal-uppl-singar-og-skynjun-td2445110.html\">Login<\/a> <a href=\"http:\/\/s-l-a-t-u-r.2169095.n2.nabble.com\/user\/Register.jtp?nextUrl=http%3A%2F%2Fs-l-a-t-u-r.2169095.n2.nabble.com%2FTungumal-uppl-singar-og-skynjun-td2445110.html\">Register<\/a> <script type=\"text\/javascript\">\/\/ <![CDATA[\/\/ 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\/><\/div>\n<\/div>\n<\/div>\n<table>\n<tbody>\n<tr>\n<td>\n<div>\n<div><a title=\"View profile of Gu\u00f0mundur Steinn Gunnarsson\" rel=\"nofollow\" href=\"http:\/\/s-l-a-t-u-r.2169095.n2.nabble.com\/template\/NamlServlet.jtp?macro=user_nodes&amp;user=tervel-2900087%7EGu%C3%B0mundur+Steinn+Gunnarsson\"><img decoding=\"async\" loading=\"lazy\" title=\"Gu\u00f0mundur Steinn Gunnarsson\" src=\"http:\/\/n2.nabble.com\/images\/avatar100.png\" alt=\"Gu\u00f0mundur Steinn Gunnarsson\" width=\"100\" height=\"100\" \/><img decoding=\"async\" title=\"User is online\" src=\"http:\/\/s-l-a-t-u-r.2169095.n2.nabble.com\/images\/online.png\" alt=\"online\" \/><\/a><\/div>\n<\/div>\n<\/td>\n<td>\n<div>Me\u00f0 \u00feessum undarlega sk\u00fdr\u00f0a \u00fer\u00e6\u00f0i vil \u00e9g b\u00faa til vettvang fyrir nokkrar samb\u00e6rilegar umr\u00e6\u00f0ur sem hafa veri\u00f0 a\u00f0 myndast \u00e1 \u00fdmsu v\u00edgst\u00f6\u00f0vum. \u00dea\u00f0 sem m\u00e9r finnst hafa veri\u00f0 \u00e1kve\u00f0nar tengdar umr\u00e6\u00f0ur eru:<\/p>\n<p>bo\u00f0fr\u00e6\u00f0i\/uppl\u00fdsingafr\u00e6\u00f0i<\/p>\n<p>s\u00e1lfr\u00e6\u00f0i og t\u00f3nlist (annars vegar dbf og \u00fdmsar n\u00fdjar p\u00e6lingar og svo gestalt Tenney\u00b4s)<\/p>\n<p>m\u00e1lv\u00edsindi og t\u00f3nlist (\u00e1 \u00fea\u00f0 vi\u00f0?, hversu samb\u00e6rileg er t\u00f3nlist vi\u00f0 tungum\u00e1l? m\u00e1lv\u00edsindi reglur\/m\u00e1lv\u00edsindi t\u00f6lfr\u00e6\u00f0i?)<\/p>\n<p>\u00deetta virkar kannski \u00f3n\u00e1kv\u00e6mt og helst til yfirgripsmiki\u00f0 en \u00ed \u00feessum umr\u00e6\u00f0um hef \u00e9g bori\u00f0 kennsl \u00e1 samb\u00e6rileg \u00feemu. \u00dear \u00e1 me\u00f0al er e\u00f0li endurtekninga og v\u00edsana \u00ed efni, au\u00f0kenni og a\u00f0greining efnis \u00ed hlj\u00f3\u00f0heimi, virkni forms og hryns (makr\u00f3 og m\u00edkr\u00f3 hryns) Og vil \u00e9g \u00fev\u00ed varpa fram nokkrum spurningum til a\u00f0 byrja \u00feetta.<\/p>\n<p>1. Endurtekningar. Skilningur e\u00f0a m\u00f6guleiki \u00e1 skilningi er b\u00fainn til \u00ed gegnum \u00e1kve\u00f0inn level af endurtekningum. \u00d6ll ofangreind fr\u00e6\u00f0i vir\u00f0ast samm\u00e1la um a\u00f0 eftir \u00feri\u00f0ju endurtekningu (e\u00f0a birtingu \u00e1 svipu\u00f0u) getur hlustandi greint og \u00feekkt fyrirb\u00e6ri og bori\u00f0 kennsl \u00e1 \u00fea\u00f0 og \u00fea\u00f0an er h\u00e6gt a\u00f0 fara a\u00f0 v\u00edsa \u00ed \u00fea\u00f0.<\/p>\n<p>2. Endurtekningarnar f\u00e1 mig til a\u00f0 hugsa um t\u00f3nsk\u00e1ld eins og Donatoni og Morton Feldman, verkin b\u00faa til tungum\u00e1l \u00ed framvindu verksins. Dav\u00ed\u00f0 sag\u00f0i \u00ed grein sinni a\u00f0 hann hef\u00f0i ekki \u00e1huga \u00e1 instant sk\u00f6pun tungum\u00e1ls innan verks s\u00edns. Skyldi \u00e9g hann r\u00e9tt, er hann a\u00f0 tala um sama hlutinn?<\/p>\n<p>3. Hva\u00f0a \u00f6nnur t\u00e6ki skapa au\u00f0kenni sem h\u00e6gt er a\u00f0 v\u00edsa \u00ed \u00ed framvindu verks, og er \u00fea\u00f0 yfir h\u00f6fu\u00f0 gott e\u00f0a sl\u00e6mt, nau\u00f0synlegt e\u00f0a \u00f3nau\u00f0synlegt?<\/p>\n<\/div>\n<\/td>\n<\/tr>\n<\/tbody>\n<\/table>\n<\/div>\n<div>\n<div>\n<div>\n<div><a href=\"http:\/\/s-l-a-t-u-r.2169095.n2.nabble.com\/template\/NamlServlet.jtp?macro=user_nodes&amp;user=tervel-2900087%7EGu%C3%B0mundur+Steinn+Gunnarsson\">Gu\u00f0mundur Steinn Gunnarsson<\/a><\/div>\n<div><img decoding=\"async\" loading=\"lazy\" title=\"Selected post\" src=\"http:\/\/s-l-a-t-u-r.2169095.n2.nabble.com\/images\/arrow.png\" alt=\"Selected post\" width=\"15\" height=\"15\" \/> Mar 09, 2009; 2:49pm<script type=\"text\/javascript\">\/\/ <![CDATA[\/\/ <![CDATA[\n\t\tNabble.get('d1236610179318-56').innerHTML= Nabble.formatDateLong(new Date(1236610179318));\n\n\/\/ ]]><\/script><\/p>\n<h2>Re: Tungum\u00e1l\/uppl\u00fdsingar og 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style\\x3D\\\"width:16px;height:16px;margin-top:.2em;border:none;\\\"\/\\x3E \\x3C\/a\\x3E','white-space:nowrap');\n\t\tdropdown.build('dd_postdropdown2449371');\n\t\tdropdown.loadOnClick('\/template\/NamlServlet.jtp?macro=post_dropdown_later&#038;node=2449371' + Nabble.getClientID() + '&#038;_=' + Math.floor(Math.random()*999999));\n\n\/\/ ]]><\/script> <img decoding=\"async\" id=\"img-starB2449371\" title=\"Click to star this item\" src=\"http:\/\/s-l-a-t-u-r.2169095.n2.nabble.com\/images\/icon_unstarred.png\" alt=\"star\" \/><\/div>\n<\/div>\n<\/div>\n<table>\n<tbody>\n<tr>\n<td>\n<div>\n<div><a title=\"View profile of Gu\u00f0mundur Steinn Gunnarsson\" rel=\"nofollow\" href=\"http:\/\/s-l-a-t-u-r.2169095.n2.nabble.com\/template\/NamlServlet.jtp?macro=user_nodes&amp;user=tervel-2900087%7EGu%C3%B0mundur+Steinn+Gunnarsson\"><img decoding=\"async\" loading=\"lazy\" title=\"Gu\u00f0mundur Steinn Gunnarsson\" src=\"http:\/\/n2.nabble.com\/images\/avatar100.png\" alt=\"Gu\u00f0mundur Steinn Gunnarsson\" width=\"100\" height=\"100\" \/><img decoding=\"async\" title=\"User is online\" src=\"http:\/\/s-l-a-t-u-r.2169095.n2.nabble.com\/images\/online.png\" alt=\"online\" \/><\/a><\/div>\n<\/div>\n<\/td>\n<td>\n<div>\u00d3kei \u00feetta var of \u00f3sk\u00fdrt til a\u00f0 nokkur heilvita ma\u00f0ur myndi svara \u00fev\u00ed, en m\u00f3tivasj\u00f3nin var s\u00fa a\u00f0 \u00e9g hef heyrt svipa\u00f0ar p\u00e6lingar r\u00e6ddar n\u00fdlega \u00far \u00fdmsum \u00e1ttum og p\u00e6lingarnar kenna sig vi\u00f0 mismunandi \u00f3t\u00f3nlistarleg fr\u00e6\u00f0i. \u00de\u00e1 er \u00e9g a\u00f0 hugsa um svipa\u00f0ar p\u00e6lingar sem \u00e9g hef s\u00e9\u00f0 \u00ed Meta-Hodos, greinum Dav\u00ed\u00f0s sem nota s\u00e1lfr\u00e6\u00f0i, uppl\u00fdsingafr\u00e6\u00f0i p\u00e6lingum \u00der\u00e1ins, og almennum p\u00e6lingum um generat\u00edva \u00feeor\u00edu (m\u00e1lf\u00e6\u00f0ifyrirmynd) og t\u00f3nlist. \u00deemun eru alltaf \u00feessi, hva\u00f0 er eining, hvernig merkir eining sig, hvernig greinir ma\u00f0ur mun \u00e1 einingum, hvernig v\u00edsar eining \u00ed a\u00f0ra, hva\u00f0 tengjir ma\u00f0ur saman og af hverju og hva\u00f0 dregur ma\u00f0ur sundur e\u00f0a \u00fat \u00far og af hverju.<\/p>\n<p>Til a\u00f0 koma umr\u00e6\u00f0u af sta\u00f0 \u00e6tla \u00e9g a\u00f0 setja fram \u00feessa einf\u00f6ldu, banal og klisjukenndu spurningu: \u201eEr t\u00f3nlist tungum\u00e1l?\u201c<\/p><\/div>\n<\/td>\n<\/tr>\n<\/tbody>\n<\/table>\n<\/div>\n<div>\n<div>\n<div>\n<div><a href=\"http:\/\/s-l-a-t-u-r.2169095.n2.nabble.com\/template\/NamlServlet.jtp?macro=user_nodes&amp;user=tervel-3623359%7E%C3%9Er%C3%A1inn+Hj%C3%A1lmarsson\">\u00der\u00e1inn Hj\u00e1lmarsson<\/a><\/div>\n<div><img decoding=\"async\" loading=\"lazy\" title=\"Selected post\" src=\"http:\/\/s-l-a-t-u-r.2169095.n2.nabble.com\/images\/arrow.png\" alt=\"Selected post\" width=\"15\" height=\"15\" \/> Mar 09, 2009; 3:51pm<script type=\"text\/javascript\">\/\/ <![CDATA[\/\/ <![CDATA[\n\t\tNabble.get('d1236613895320-10').innerHTML= Nabble.formatDateLong(new Date(1236613895320));\n\n\/\/ ]]><\/script><\/p>\n<h2>Re: Tungum\u00e1l\/uppl\u00fdsingar og skynjun<\/h2>\n<\/div>\n<div><a rel=\"nofollow\" href=\"http:\/\/s-l-a-t-u-r.2169095.n2.nabble.com\/template\/NamlServlet.jtp?macro=reply&amp;node=2449768\">Reply<\/a> | \t\t\t\t\t<a onclick=\"Nabble.setView('threaded', '\/Tungumal-uppl-singar-og-skynjun-tt2445110.html#a2449768',null)\" href=\"javascript:void(0)\">Threaded<\/a> | \t\t\t\t\t<a title=\"Click for more options\" href=\"javascript:void(0)\">More<\/a> <img decoding=\"async\" loading=\"lazy\" title=\"Click for more options\" src=\"http:\/\/s-l-a-t-u-r.2169095.n2.nabble.com\/images\/more.png\" alt=\"\" width=\"10\" height=\"10\" \/><\/p>\n<table>\n<tbody>\n<tr id=\"_loadingpostdropdown2449768\">\n<td>Loading&#8230;<\/td>\n<\/tr>\n<tr id=\"editPost2449768\">\n<td><a rel=\"nofollow\" 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\/><\/div>\n<\/div>\n<\/div>\n<table>\n<tbody>\n<tr>\n<td>\n<div>\n<div><a title=\"View profile of \u00der\u00e1inn Hj\u00e1lmarsson\" rel=\"nofollow\" href=\"http:\/\/s-l-a-t-u-r.2169095.n2.nabble.com\/template\/NamlServlet.jtp?macro=user_nodes&amp;user=tervel-3623359%7E%C3%9Er%C3%A1inn+Hj%C3%A1lmarsson\"><img decoding=\"async\" loading=\"lazy\" title=\"\u00der\u00e1inn Hj\u00e1lmarsson\" src=\"http:\/\/n2.nabble.com\/images\/avatar100.png\" alt=\"\u00der\u00e1inn Hj\u00e1lmarsson\" width=\"100\" height=\"100\" \/><img decoding=\"async\" title=\"User is online\" src=\"http:\/\/s-l-a-t-u-r.2169095.n2.nabble.com\/images\/online.png\" alt=\"online\" \/><\/a><\/div>\n<\/div>\n<\/td>\n<td>\n<div>Er t\u00f3nlist tungum\u00e1l? \u00deetta er skemmtileg spurning og \u00e9g held a\u00f0 alltof margir hafi r\u00f3mant\u00edkera\u00f0 illa \u00ed buxurnar me\u00f0 \u00fev\u00ed a\u00f0 halda \u00fev\u00ed fram. T\u00f3nlist er ekki bara tungum\u00e1l, \u00e9g a\u00f0hyllist allar p\u00e6lingar sem a\u00f0 koma fr\u00e1 Austurheimi sem sn\u00faast um l\u00e6kningarm\u00e1tt hlj\u00f3\u00f0a. En engu a\u00f0 s\u00ed\u00f0ur ver\u00f0 \u00e9g a\u00f0 nefna a\u00f0 \u00fea\u00f0 er margt sem h\u00e6gt er a\u00f0 nota \u00ed t\u00f3nlist sem skylst fyrir tilstilli tungum\u00e1lsins og okkar hugsun \u00ed tungum\u00e1li (einsog a\u00f0 l\u00e6ra a\u00f0 k\u00f3\u00f0a er ekki bara a\u00f0 l\u00e6ra skipanir heldur einnig a\u00f0 geta hugsa\u00f0 hlutina \u00e1 l\u00f3g\u00edskan h\u00e1tt svo h\u00e6gt s\u00e9 a\u00f0 \u00fatb\u00faa k\u00f3\u00f0ann).<\/p>\n<p>\u00cd BA-ritger\u00f0inni minni fer \u00e9g \u00fat \u00ed hugmyndina um tungum\u00e1l \u00ed bo\u00f0fr\u00e6\u00f0inni, a\u00f0 \u00ed raun er skilgreiningin \u00e1 tungum\u00e1li sl\u00edk a\u00f0 um s\u00e9 a\u00f0 r\u00e6\u00f0a l\u00e6r\u00f0 bo\u00f0 (e. signal) (myndar bo\u00f0safn (e. alphabet)) sem geta skapa\u00f0 innri f\u00fanksj\u00f3n \u00ed samhengi \u00ed tj\u00e1mi\u00f0i (e. message) en \u00e1 hinn b\u00f3ginn eru bo\u00f0in afk\u00f3\u00f0u\u00f0 af m\u00f3ttakandanum sem lestur \u00ed \u00feessu bo\u00f0safni (\u00feau eru sem s\u00e9 afk\u00f3\u00f0u\u00f0 tvisvar sinnum sem bo\u00f0 \u00ed bo\u00f0safni og sem partur af tj\u00e1mi\u00f0i), hvert og eitt bo\u00f0 er afk\u00f3\u00f0a\u00f0 eftir \u00fev\u00ed hva\u00f0a meiningu \u00fea\u00f0 beri me\u00f0 s\u00e9r samkv\u00e6mt bo\u00f0safninu en einnig er tj\u00e1mi\u00f0i\u00f0 lesi\u00f0 \u00fatfr\u00e1 samhengi \u00feeirra meiningar. \u00deetta er nokku\u00f0 fl\u00f3ki\u00f0 \u00ed bo\u00f0fr\u00e6\u00f0inni en \u00fea\u00f0 ver\u00f0ur a\u00f0 taka fram a\u00f0 ekki er h\u00e6gt a\u00f0 tj\u00e1 meiningu (e. meaning) \u00ed tj\u00e1skiptum \u00e1n fyrirfram skilgreinds bo\u00f0safns. H\u00e9r ver\u00f0i\u00f0 \u00fei\u00f0 a\u00f0 opna hugann um hva\u00f0 meining er.<\/p>\n<p>\u00deess vegna bar \u00e9g \u00feetta saman vi\u00f0 t\u00f3nlistina er var\u00f0ar at\u00f3nal- og t\u00f3nal-t\u00f3nm\u00e1l \u00ed t\u00f3nlist. \u00cd t\u00f3nal-t\u00f3nm\u00e1linu komum vi\u00f0 a\u00f0 fyrirfram \u00e1kve\u00f0nu tungum\u00e1li sem vi\u00f0 l\u00e6rum inn \u00e1 (m\u00f6gulega vegna einfaldleikans og jafnvel einhverrar s\u00e6k\u00f3ak\u00fast\u00edk (er ekki hrifinn af \u00feannig umr\u00e6\u00f0u)). \u00dea\u00f0 er til forhlj\u00f3mur og grunnt\u00f3nn, vi\u00f0 skiljum hann \u00ed samhengi og ekki. A\u00f0 auki \u00feessari f\u00fanskj\u00f3n er reynt a\u00f0 imitera r\u00e6\u00f0ulistina \u00ed gegnum laghendingar og sl\u00edkt \u00ed t\u00f3nm\u00e1li, markvisst er reynt a\u00f0 herma eftir expressj\u00f3num \u00ed talanda m\u00e1li. M\u00e9r skylst l\u00edka a\u00f0 Bach hafi veri\u00f0 \u00f3tr\u00falega hrifinn af textum um rhetor\u00edk upp \u00e1 \u00fea\u00f0 hvernig gera eigi r\u00e6\u00f0u, \u00fe.e. formr\u00e6na hennar og sl\u00edkt og a\u00f0 \u00f6llum l\u00edkindum hefur \u00fea\u00f0 drifi\u00f0 inn \u00ed t\u00f3nlistina hans.<\/p>\n<p>Expressj\u00f3nin \u00ed laghendingum er \u00fea\u00f0 eina sem var\u00f0 eftir \u00ed \u00fer\u00f3uninni fr\u00e1 t\u00f3nal yfir \u00ed at\u00f3nal-tungum\u00e1l, \u00fea\u00f0 var \u00feessi \u00f3tr\u00falega expressj\u00f3n en engu a\u00f0 s\u00ed\u00f0ur vanta\u00f0i tungum\u00e1li\u00f0 \u00e1 bakvi\u00f0 (bo\u00f0safni\u00f0), \u00fatkoman er bara jive, arfleif\u00f0ina m\u00e1 finna \u00ed effekt\u00faal effekt\u00faal t\u00f3nlist dagsins \u00ed dag, expressj\u00f3n talandans en engin \u00ed raun meining \u00fev\u00ed \u00fea\u00f0 vantar t\u00f3nm\u00e1li\u00f0. En \u00fear koma einnig inn hugmyndir um atbur\u00f0ar\u00f6\u00f0 sem g\u00e6ti skapa\u00f0 samhengi, \u00fear kemur jafnvel gestalt-s\u00e1lfr\u00e6\u00f0ip\u00e6lingin inn. Effekt\u00faal-p\u00e6lingin er l\u00edka notu\u00f0 til \u00feess a\u00f0 reyna a\u00f0 skapa hugmynd um einingu (b\u00faa til or\u00f0), \u00fe.e. a\u00f0 eitthva\u00f0 s\u00e9 a\u00f0greint fr\u00e1 \u00f6\u00f0ru hlj\u00f3\u00f0i.<\/p>\n<p>Kannski anna\u00f0 irrelat\u00edft, en engu a\u00f0 s\u00ed\u00f0ur tengist t\u00f3nlist.<\/p>\n<p>\u00c9g minnist or\u00f0a Morton Subotnick um minnsta sameiginlega samnefnara sem hann fann \u00ed t\u00f3nlist, allt fr\u00e1 framandi l\u00f6ndum til Beethoven og fleiri t\u00f3nlistar. \u00dea\u00f0 var \u00feessi tilfinning fyrir hugmyndinni um 1, 2, nokkra og marga \u00ed t\u00f3nlist. Hann t\u00f3k sem d\u00e6mi eroica-s\u00ednf\u00f3n\u00edu Beethoven \u00fear sem hann t\u00f3k eftir \u00fev\u00ed hvernig hugmyndin um einn til tvo hlj\u00f3\u00f0f\u00e6raleikara me\u00f0 sitt eigi\u00f0 efni fengu seinna meir hlj\u00f3mgrunn hj\u00e1 allri hlj\u00f3msveitinni, \u00fearna er \u00fev\u00ed einhvers konar mi\u00f0lun me\u00f0 \u00feessa hugmynd um einn, nokkra og marga.<\/p>\n<p>POSTSCRIPT<br \/>\n\u00dea\u00f0 sem mig langar a\u00f0 nefna a\u00f0 s\u00e9u tilraun til \u00feess a\u00f0 elta tungum\u00e1li\u00f0 \u00ed t\u00f3nlist eru t\u00f3nal-t\u00f3nlist, at\u00f3nal-t\u00f3nlist og effekt\u00faal-t\u00f3nlist. \u00deetta eru t\u00f3nlistarstefnur sem \u00e9g hreinlega finn mig ekki \u00ed.<br \/>\n\u00c9g hef opna\u00f0 fyrir download af BA ritger\u00f0inni minni fyrir alla, sj\u00e1 gagnasafn.<\/p><\/div>\n<\/td>\n<\/tr>\n<\/tbody>\n<\/table>\n<\/div>\n<div>\n<div>\n<div>\n<div><a href=\"http:\/\/s-l-a-t-u-r.2169095.n2.nabble.com\/template\/NamlServlet.jtp?macro=user_nodes&amp;user=tervel-3146947%7EDavid+Brynjar+Franzson\">David Brynjar Franzson<\/a><\/div>\n<div><img decoding=\"async\" loading=\"lazy\" title=\"Selected post\" src=\"http:\/\/s-l-a-t-u-r.2169095.n2.nabble.com\/images\/arrow.png\" alt=\"Selected post\" width=\"15\" height=\"15\" \/> Mar 09, 2009; 4:51pm<script type=\"text\/javascript\">\/\/ <![CDATA[\/\/ <![CDATA[\n\t\tNabble.get('d1236617491086-232').innerHTML= Nabble.formatDateLong(new Date(1236617491086));\n\n\/\/ ]]><\/script><\/p>\n<h2>Re: Tungum\u00e1l\/uppl\u00fdsingar og skynjun<\/h2>\n<\/div>\n<div><a rel=\"nofollow\" href=\"http:\/\/s-l-a-t-u-r.2169095.n2.nabble.com\/template\/NamlServlet.jtp?macro=reply&amp;node=2450136\">Reply<\/a> | \t\t\t\t\t<a onclick=\"Nabble.setView('threaded', '\/Tungumal-uppl-singar-og-skynjun-tt2445110.html#a2450136',null)\" href=\"javascript:void(0)\">Threaded<\/a> | \t\t\t\t\t<a title=\"Click for more 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style\\x3D\\\"width:16px;height:16px;margin-top:.2em;border:none;\\\"\/\\x3E \\x3C\/a\\x3E \\x3Ca href\\x3D\\\"http:\/\/digg.com\/submit?phase\\x3D2&amp;url\\x3Dhttp%3A%2F%2Fs-l-a-t-u-r.2169095.n2.nabble.com%2FTungumal-uppl-singar-og-skynjun-tp2445110p2450136.html&amp;title\\x3DRe%3A+Tungum%C3%A1l%2Fuppl%C3%BDsingar+og+skynjun\\\" title\\x3D\\\"Digg\\\" target\\x3D\\\"_blank\\\" ignore\\x3D\\\"y\\\"\\x3E \\x3Cimg src\\x3D\\\"\/images\/social\/digg.png\\\" style\\x3D\\\"width:16px;height:16px;margin-top:.2em;border:none;\\\"\/\\x3E \\x3C\/a\\x3E','white-space:nowrap');\n\t\tdropdown.build('dd_postdropdown2450136');\n\t\tdropdown.loadOnClick('\/template\/NamlServlet.jtp?macro=post_dropdown_later&#038;node=2450136' + Nabble.getClientID() + '&#038;_=' + Math.floor(Math.random()*999999));\n\n\/\/ ]]><\/script> <img decoding=\"async\" id=\"img-starB2450136\" title=\"Click to star this item\" src=\"http:\/\/s-l-a-t-u-r.2169095.n2.nabble.com\/images\/icon_unstarred.png\" alt=\"star\" \/><\/div>\n<\/div>\n<\/div>\n<table>\n<tbody>\n<tr>\n<td>\n<div>\n<div><a title=\"View profile of David Brynjar Franzson\" rel=\"nofollow\" href=\"http:\/\/s-l-a-t-u-r.2169095.n2.nabble.com\/template\/NamlServlet.jtp?macro=user_nodes&amp;user=tervel-3146947%7EDavid+Brynjar+Franzson\"><img decoding=\"async\" loading=\"lazy\" title=\"David Brynjar Franzson\" src=\"http:\/\/n2.nabble.com\/images\/avatar100.png\" alt=\"David Brynjar Franzson\" width=\"100\" height=\"100\" \/><img decoding=\"async\" title=\"User is online\" src=\"http:\/\/s-l-a-t-u-r.2169095.n2.nabble.com\/images\/online.png\" alt=\"online\" \/><\/a><\/div>\n<\/div>\n<\/td>\n<td>\n<div>\u00c9g veit ekki einu sinni hver \u00fe\u00fa ert lengur: &#8220;T\u00f3nlist er ekki bara tungum\u00e1l&#8221; BARA? BAAARAA?<\/p>\n<p>T\u00f3nlist er ekki tungum\u00e1l, meira um \u00fea\u00f0 s\u00ed\u00f0ar.<\/p><\/div>\n<\/td>\n<\/tr>\n<\/tbody>\n<\/table>\n<\/div>\n<div>\n<div>\n<div>\n<div><a href=\"http:\/\/s-l-a-t-u-r.2169095.n2.nabble.com\/template\/NamlServlet.jtp?macro=user_nodes&amp;user=tervel-3623359%7E%C3%9Er%C3%A1inn+Hj%C3%A1lmarsson\">\u00der\u00e1inn Hj\u00e1lmarsson<\/a><\/div>\n<div><img decoding=\"async\" loading=\"lazy\" title=\"Selected post\" src=\"http:\/\/s-l-a-t-u-r.2169095.n2.nabble.com\/images\/arrow.png\" alt=\"Selected post\" width=\"15\" height=\"15\" \/> Mar 09, 2009; 5:53pm<script type=\"text\/javascript\">\/\/ <![CDATA[\/\/ <![CDATA[\n\t\tNabble.get('d1236621218410-314').innerHTML= Nabble.formatDateLong(new Date(1236621218410));\n\n\/\/ ]]><\/script><\/p>\n<h2>Re: Tungum\u00e1l\/uppl\u00fdsingar og skynjun<\/h2>\n<\/div>\n<div><a rel=\"nofollow\" href=\"http:\/\/s-l-a-t-u-r.2169095.n2.nabble.com\/template\/NamlServlet.jtp?macro=reply&amp;node=2450543\">Reply<\/a> | 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\/><\/div>\n<\/div>\n<\/div>\n<table>\n<tbody>\n<tr>\n<td>\n<div>\n<div><a title=\"View profile of \u00der\u00e1inn Hj\u00e1lmarsson\" rel=\"nofollow\" href=\"http:\/\/s-l-a-t-u-r.2169095.n2.nabble.com\/template\/NamlServlet.jtp?macro=user_nodes&amp;user=tervel-3623359%7E%C3%9Er%C3%A1inn+Hj%C3%A1lmarsson\"><img decoding=\"async\" loading=\"lazy\" title=\"\u00der\u00e1inn Hj\u00e1lmarsson\" src=\"http:\/\/n2.nabble.com\/images\/avatar100.png\" alt=\"\u00der\u00e1inn Hj\u00e1lmarsson\" width=\"100\" height=\"100\" \/><img decoding=\"async\" title=\"User is online\" src=\"http:\/\/s-l-a-t-u-r.2169095.n2.nabble.com\/images\/online.png\" alt=\"online\" \/><\/a><\/div>\n<\/div>\n<\/td>\n<td>\n<div>me\u00f0 bara meina \u00e9g einv\u00f6r\u00f0ungu, me\u00f0 einv\u00f6r\u00f0ungu meina \u00e9g einungis.<\/p>\n<p>m\u00e1li\u00f0 er a\u00f0 \u00e9g var a\u00f0 nefna a\u00f0 t\u00f3nlist hefur unni\u00f0 me\u00f0 tungum\u00e1laleg element hinga\u00f0 til.<\/p><\/div>\n<\/td>\n<\/tr>\n<\/tbody>\n<\/table>\n<\/div>\n<div>\n<div>\n<div>\n<div><a href=\"http:\/\/s-l-a-t-u-r.2169095.n2.nabble.com\/template\/NamlServlet.jtp?macro=user_nodes&amp;user=tervel-2900087%7EGu%C3%B0mundur+Steinn+Gunnarsson\">Gu\u00f0mundur Steinn Gunnarsson<\/a><\/div>\n<div><img decoding=\"async\" loading=\"lazy\" title=\"Selected post\" src=\"http:\/\/s-l-a-t-u-r.2169095.n2.nabble.com\/images\/arrow.png\" alt=\"Selected post\" width=\"15\" height=\"15\" \/> Mar 09, 2009; 6:23pm<script type=\"text\/javascript\">\/\/ <![CDATA[\/\/ <![CDATA[\n\t\tNabble.get('d1236622983730-874').innerHTML= Nabble.formatDateLong(new Date(1236622983730));\n\n\/\/ ]]><\/script><\/p>\n<h2>Re: Tungum\u00e1l\/uppl\u00fdsingar og skynjun<\/h2>\n<\/div>\n<div><a rel=\"nofollow\" href=\"http:\/\/s-l-a-t-u-r.2169095.n2.nabble.com\/template\/NamlServlet.jtp?macro=reply&amp;node=2450731\">Reply<\/a> | \t\t\t\t\t<a onclick=\"Nabble.setView('threaded', 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\/><\/div>\n<\/div>\n<\/div>\n<table>\n<tbody>\n<tr>\n<td>\n<div>\n<div><a title=\"View profile of Gu\u00f0mundur Steinn Gunnarsson\" rel=\"nofollow\" href=\"http:\/\/s-l-a-t-u-r.2169095.n2.nabble.com\/template\/NamlServlet.jtp?macro=user_nodes&amp;user=tervel-2900087%7EGu%C3%B0mundur+Steinn+Gunnarsson\"><img decoding=\"async\" loading=\"lazy\" title=\"Gu\u00f0mundur Steinn Gunnarsson\" src=\"http:\/\/n2.nabble.com\/images\/avatar100.png\" alt=\"Gu\u00f0mundur Steinn Gunnarsson\" width=\"100\" height=\"100\" \/><img decoding=\"async\" title=\"User is online\" src=\"http:\/\/s-l-a-t-u-r.2169095.n2.nabble.com\/images\/online.png\" alt=\"online\" \/><\/a><\/div>\n<\/div>\n<\/td>\n<td>\n<div>\u00c9g setti \u00feetta fram til a\u00f0 f\u00e1 h\u00f6r\u00f0 vi\u00f0br\u00f6g\u00f0, vitandi a\u00f0 dbf yr\u00f0i rei\u00f0ur og myndi segja s\u00ednar sko\u00f0anir og \u00fat fr\u00e1 \u00fev\u00ed myndu hefjast miklar umr\u00e6\u00f0ur. \u00dea\u00f0 t\u00f3kst ekki, hann var\u00f0 of m\u00f3\u00f0ga\u00f0ur til a\u00f0 svara, hva\u00f0 \u00e1 \u00e9g a\u00f0 gera? N\u00fa, kannski hella ol\u00edu \u00e1 eldinn&#8230;<\/p>\n<p>Semsagt, j\u00fa, t\u00f3nlist er tungum\u00e1l. Ef vi\u00f0 heyrum fugla syngja, vitum vi\u00f0 \u00ed raun hvort \u00feeir eru a\u00f0 tala e\u00f0a syngja? \u00dear af lei\u00f0andi er t\u00f3nlist tungum\u00e1l og h\u00e6gt a\u00f0 setja M\u00c1LFR\u00c6\u00d0ILEGAR, ENDANLEGAR REGLUR um heg\u00f0un t\u00f3nlistar. Ekki satt?<\/p><\/div>\n<\/td>\n<\/tr>\n<\/tbody>\n<\/table>\n<\/div>\n<div>\n<div>\n<div>\n<div><a href=\"http:\/\/s-l-a-t-u-r.2169095.n2.nabble.com\/template\/NamlServlet.jtp?macro=user_nodes&amp;user=tervel-3146947%7EDavid+Brynjar+Franzson\">David Brynjar Franzson<\/a><\/div>\n<div><img decoding=\"async\" loading=\"lazy\" title=\"Selected post\" src=\"http:\/\/s-l-a-t-u-r.2169095.n2.nabble.com\/images\/arrow.png\" alt=\"Selected post\" width=\"15\" height=\"15\" \/> Mar 09, 2009; 7:25pm<script type=\"text\/javascript\">\/\/ <![CDATA[\/\/ <![CDATA[\n\t\tNabble.get('d1236626756400-74').innerHTML= Nabble.formatDateLong(new Date(1236626756400));\n\n\/\/ ]]><\/script><\/p>\n<h2>Re: Tungum\u00e1l\/uppl\u00fdsingar og skynjun<\/h2>\n<\/div>\n<div><a rel=\"nofollow\" href=\"http:\/\/s-l-a-t-u-r.2169095.n2.nabble.com\/template\/NamlServlet.jtp?macro=reply&amp;node=2451100\">Reply<\/a> | \t\t\t\t\t<a onclick=\"Nabble.setView('threaded', 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\/><\/div>\n<\/div>\n<\/div>\n<table>\n<tbody>\n<tr>\n<td>\n<div>\n<div><a title=\"View profile of David Brynjar Franzson\" rel=\"nofollow\" href=\"http:\/\/s-l-a-t-u-r.2169095.n2.nabble.com\/template\/NamlServlet.jtp?macro=user_nodes&amp;user=tervel-3146947%7EDavid+Brynjar+Franzson\"><img decoding=\"async\" loading=\"lazy\" title=\"David Brynjar Franzson\" src=\"http:\/\/n2.nabble.com\/images\/avatar100.png\" alt=\"David Brynjar Franzson\" width=\"100\" height=\"100\" \/><img decoding=\"async\" title=\"User is online\" src=\"http:\/\/s-l-a-t-u-r.2169095.n2.nabble.com\/images\/online.png\" alt=\"online\" \/><\/a><\/div>\n<\/div>\n<\/td>\n<td>\n<div>Svari\u00f0 kemur, \u00e9g er bara a\u00f0 safna orku til a\u00f0 skrifa \u00fev\u00ed \u00fea\u00f0 tekur sennilega nokkrar klukkustundir a\u00f0 skrifa og melta gott svar. Svari\u00f0 mun s\u00e9rstaklega \u00e1varpa afhverju fuglas\u00f6ngur e\u00f0a d\u00fdra samskipti eru ekki tungum\u00e1l. En \u00ed bili er n\u00f3g a\u00f0 segja a\u00f0 \u00fea\u00f0 eitt a\u00f0 h\u00e6gt s\u00e9 a\u00f0 setja m\u00e1lfr\u00e6\u00f0ilegar reglur um \u00fea\u00f0 gerir \u00fea\u00f0 ekki a\u00f0 tungum\u00e1li.<\/p>\n<p>Kannski \u00e9g skelli m\u00e9r bara \u00ed \u00feetta n\u00fana. Ver\u00f0ur p\u00ednu k\u00e1ssukennt fyrir viki\u00f0.<\/p>\n<p>H\u00e9r er nefnilega veri\u00f0 a\u00f0 rugla saman tveim hlutum. Annarsvegar tungum\u00e1l (language) og hinsvegar bo\u00f0kerfi (symbolic system, kann ekki alv\u00f6ru \u00edslenskt or\u00f0 yfir \u00fea\u00f0 svo \u00fea\u00f0 \u00fearf a\u00f0 duga).<\/p>\n<p>Bo\u00f0kerfi er hva\u00f0a \u00fea\u00f0 kerfi sem leyfir einstakling A \u00e1 einum enda bo\u00f0l\u00ednu a\u00f0 senda bo\u00f0 X til einstaklings B \u00fear sem eintaklingur B getur m\u00f3tteki\u00f0 og skili\u00f0 bo\u00f0in \u00e1 sama h\u00e1tt og A setti \u00feau fram. Uppl\u00fdsingafr\u00e6\u00f0in f\u00e6st vi\u00f0 \u00feetta fyrirb\u00e6ri. \u00deetta getur veri\u00f0 allt fr\u00e1 algebrurith\u00e6tti yfir \u00ed mj\u00f6g fl\u00f3kin kerfi. H\u00e6gt er a\u00f0 halda uppi samskiptum \u00ed gegnum \u00feetta kerfi.<\/p>\n<p>Tungum\u00e1l er s\u00e9rt\u00e6kt bo\u00f0kerfi sem hefur \u00feann s\u00e9rstaka eiginleika a\u00f0 geta referensa\u00f0 sj\u00e1lft sig \u00e1n endurtekningar \u00e1 or\u00f0um og ver\u00f0ur a\u00f0 bj\u00f3\u00f0a upp \u00e1 \u00feann m\u00f6guleika a\u00f0 h\u00e6gt s\u00e9 a\u00f0 skilgreina \u00f3s\u00e9\u00f0 fyrirb\u00e6ri me\u00f0 eldri or\u00f0um og a\u00f0 h\u00e6gt s\u00e9 a\u00f0 sj\u00f3\u00f0a saman eldri hugt\u00f6k \u00ed n\u00fd hugt\u00f6k.<\/p>\n<p>\u00dear me\u00f0 v\u00e6ri h\u00e6gt a\u00f0 b\u00faa til tungum\u00e1l sem notar hlj\u00f3\u00f0f\u00e6ri sem hlj\u00f3\u00f0gjafa svo lengi sem a\u00f0ilar A og B myndu b\u00e1\u00f0ir setjast ni\u00f0ur og l\u00e6ra tungum\u00e1li\u00f0. \u00c1 hinn boginn er ekki neitt sem bendir til \u00feess a\u00f0 \u00ed t\u00f3nlist s\u00e9u til a priori fyrirb\u00e6ri sem hafi \u00feann m\u00f6guleika a\u00f0 vera bo\u00f0berar. \u00dea\u00f0 a\u00f0 segja a\u00f0 t\u00f3nlist s\u00e9 tungum\u00e1l er \u00fea\u00f0 sama og a\u00f0 segja a\u00f0 allt sem \u00e9g framlei\u00f0i me\u00f0 raddb\u00f6ndunum m\u00ednum s\u00e9 tungum\u00e1l. \u00dea\u00f0 er ekki r\u00e9tt. \u00dea\u00f0 getur vel veri\u00f0 a\u00f0 \u00fea\u00f0 s\u00e9 allt saman samskipta form, i.e. a\u00f0 f\u00f3lk skilji eitthva\u00f0 \u00far \u00fev\u00ed sem \u00e9g v\u00e6ri a\u00f0 urra og v\u00e6la, t.d. gr\u00f3flega hva\u00f0a tilfinningar eru \u00ed gangi, en \u00e9g g\u00e6ti ekki \u00fatsk\u00fdrt me\u00f0 \u00feessum \u00f3hlj\u00f3\u00f0um hva\u00f0 eitthva\u00f0 n\u00fdtt urr \u00fe\u00fdddi nema \u00e9g g\u00e6ti einhvernvegin dregi\u00f0 athygli a\u00f0 \u00fev\u00ed hva\u00f0 \u00fea\u00f0 er sem \u00e9g er a\u00f0 reyna a\u00f0 \u00fatsk\u00fdra sem \u00e9g hreinlega g\u00e6ti ekki nema a\u00f0 til v\u00e6ri einhver a\u00f0fer\u00f0 \u00ed &#8220;tungum\u00e1linu&#8221; til a\u00f0 tala um sj\u00e1lft sig.<\/p>\n<p>Skiptir engu m\u00e1li hvort \u00fe\u00fa &#8220;viljir&#8221; einhverjar m\u00e1lfr\u00e6\u00f0ireglur \u00e1 \u00fea\u00f0, \u00fea\u00f0 gerir \u00fea\u00f0 ekki a\u00f0 tungum\u00e1li fyrir \u00e1heyrandann. \u00dea\u00f0 getur vel veri\u00f0 a\u00f0 \u00fea\u00f0 hafi hlj\u00f3manda af tungum\u00e1li en \u00fea\u00f0 er ekki symbolic system nema a\u00f0 \u00fe\u00fa getir s\u00fdnt fram \u00e1 a\u00f0 \u00fe\u00fa hafir komm\u00fanikera\u00f0 eitthva\u00f0 fr\u00e1 A til B og ekki tungum\u00e1l nema a\u00f0 \u00fe\u00fa getir \u00ed raun kennt hlustandanum eitthva\u00f0, ekki um t\u00f3nlistina, heldur eitthva\u00f0 anna\u00f0, eins og t.d. mengjafr\u00e6\u00f0i.<\/p>\n<p>\u00dearna koma fram tveir \u00fe\u00e6ttir. Annarsvegar hven\u00e6r h\u00e6gt s\u00e9 a\u00f0 segja a\u00f0 tungum\u00e1l s\u00e9 nota\u00f0. Tengdafa\u00f0ir minn var \u00e1 t\u00edma doktorslei\u00f0beinandi konunnar sem \u00e1tti g\u00f3rilluna Coco. Eins og allir vita hefur \u00fev\u00ed veri\u00f0 lengi haldi\u00f0 fram a\u00f0 Coco kunni a\u00f0 tala tungum\u00e1l. H\u00fan var rekin \u00far doktorspr\u00f3gramminu eftir a\u00f0 h\u00fan neita\u00f0i a\u00f0 l\u00e1ta \u00e1 \u00fea\u00f0 reyna hvort Coco g\u00e6ti l\u00e6rt eitthva\u00f0 \u00ed gegnum tungum\u00e1li\u00f0. Hann lag\u00f0i til mengjafr\u00e6\u00f0i og h\u00fan \u00feor\u00f0i ekki a\u00f0 l\u00e1ta \u00e1 \u00fea\u00f0 reyna. \u00cd raun voru aldrei neinar sannanir fyrir hendi a\u00f0 h\u00fan g\u00e6ti tj\u00e1\u00f0 sig nema ef eigandin var n\u00e6rri og \u00fev\u00ed er mj\u00f6g l\u00edklegt a\u00f0 ekki hafi veri\u00f0 um raunverulegan skilning \u00e1 tungum\u00e1li a\u00f0 r\u00e6\u00f0a heldur l\u00e6r\u00f0an s\u00e9rt\u00e6kan sklining \u00e1 heg\u00f0un eigandans. Sama \u00e1 vi\u00f0 um eina tilviki\u00f0 \u00fear sem tali\u00f0 er a simpansi hafi n\u00e1\u00f0 a\u00f0 nota tungum\u00e1l, sem var \u00feegar hann setti saman hugtaki\u00f0 vatns-fugl til a\u00f0 l\u00fdsa \u00f6nd. Sannleikurinn \u00fear var s\u00e1 a\u00f0 setningin var &#8220;Vatn Vatn Vatn Fugl Fugl Vatn&#8221; sem segir ekkert til um a\u00f0 \u00feetta hafi veri\u00f0 n\u00fdtt hugtak. \u00dea\u00f0 er miklu l\u00edklegra a\u00f0 hann hafi einfaldlega veri\u00f0 a\u00f0 l\u00e1ta vita af \u00fev\u00ed a\u00f0 hann s\u00e6ji vatn og a\u00f0 hann s\u00e6ji fugl. Fyrir viki\u00f0 er s\u00e1lfr\u00e6\u00f0i b\u00fain a\u00f0 yfirgefa notkun or\u00f0sins &#8220;tungum\u00e1l&#8221; yfir tj\u00e1skipti d\u00fdra og manna. \u00dea\u00f0 er tj\u00e1kerfi til sta\u00f0ar en ekki tungum\u00e1l.<\/p>\n<p>Hinn \u00fe\u00e1tturinn er a\u00f0 \u00fea\u00f0 er miklu l\u00edklegra a\u00f0 t\u00f3nlist hafi eitthva\u00f0 me\u00f0 \u00feann \u00fe\u00e1tt tj\u00e1skipta sem falla undir hlut sem kallast para-linguistics. \u00deetta eru allir \u00feeir \u00fe\u00e6ttir sem hafa \u00a0me\u00f0 mannleg tj\u00e1skipti a\u00f0 gera sem eru ekki or\u00f0 e\u00f0a or\u00f0ar\u00f6\u00f0 (samkv\u00e6mt ranns\u00f3knum \u00fe\u00e1 hefur r\u00f6\u00f0 or\u00f0a a\u00f0eins um 30% \u00e1hrif \u00e1 getu B til a\u00f0 skilja sendingu fr\u00e1 A). \u00deessir \u00fe\u00e6ttir eru t.d. t\u00f3nh\u00e6\u00f0 raddar, t\u00f3nbrig\u00f0i, hra\u00f0i, breyting \u00e1 hra\u00f0a, hversu oft breyting ver\u00f0ur, formant str\u00fakt\u00far, hversu miki\u00f0 af n\u00fdjum or\u00f0um eru notu\u00f0, hversu algeng or\u00f0 eru, hversu fl\u00f3kin or\u00f0 eru, o.s.frv. \u00deetta er miklu n\u00e6r fuglas\u00f6ngnum heldur en tungum\u00e1li\u00f0 sj\u00e1lft.<\/p><\/div>\n<\/td>\n<\/tr>\n<\/tbody>\n<\/table>\n<\/div>\n<div>\n<div>\n<div>\n<div><a href=\"http:\/\/s-l-a-t-u-r.2169095.n2.nabble.com\/template\/NamlServlet.jtp?macro=user_nodes&amp;user=tervel-3623359%7E%C3%9Er%C3%A1inn+Hj%C3%A1lmarsson\">\u00der\u00e1inn Hj\u00e1lmarsson<\/a><\/div>\n<div><img decoding=\"async\" loading=\"lazy\" title=\"Selected post\" src=\"http:\/\/s-l-a-t-u-r.2169095.n2.nabble.com\/images\/arrow.png\" alt=\"Selected post\" width=\"15\" height=\"15\" \/> Mar 10, 2009; 12:16pm<script type=\"text\/javascript\">\/\/ <![CDATA[\/\/ <![CDATA[\n\t\tNabble.get('d1236687401810-113').innerHTML= Nabble.formatDateLong(new Date(1236687401810));\n\n\/\/ ]]><\/script><\/p>\n<h2>Re: Tungum\u00e1l\/uppl\u00fdsingar og skynjun<\/h2>\n<\/div>\n<div><a rel=\"nofollow\" 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Hj\u00e1lmarsson\" width=\"100\" height=\"100\" \/><img decoding=\"async\" title=\"User is online\" src=\"http:\/\/s-l-a-t-u-r.2169095.n2.nabble.com\/images\/online.png\" alt=\"online\" \/><\/a><\/div>\n<\/div>\n<\/td>\n<td>\n<div>jah\u00e1, \u00e9g vir\u00f0ist vera samm\u00e1la \u00feessu \u00f6llu saman, hef ekki lagt \u00ed \u00fea\u00f0 a\u00f0 lesa mig til um para-linguistics, vir\u00f0ist vera r\u00e9tt. En til a\u00f0 vera \u00f3samm\u00e1la \u00fe\u00e1 ver\u00f0 \u00e9g a\u00f0 nefna a\u00f0 til \u00feess a\u00f0 h\u00e6gt ver\u00f0i a\u00f0 geta tj\u00e1\u00f0 sig um mengjafr\u00e6\u00f0i \u00ed gegnum t\u00f3nlist \u00fearf bara a\u00f0 \u00fer\u00f3a tungum\u00e1li\u00f0 lengra, afmarka enn frekar reglur og voil\u00e1 \u00fe\u00fa getur tj\u00e1\u00f0 \u00feig um mengjafr\u00e6\u00f0i \u00ed gegnum t\u00f3nlist. \u00deetta eru grunnskrefin sem hafa veri\u00f0 tekin.<\/p>\n<p>En hins vegar er \u00e9g a\u00f0 lesa Meta-Hodos eftir Tenney og h\u00e6gt og r\u00f3lega mun \u00e9g tala um p\u00e6lingar Tenneys \u00ed \u00feessum \u00fer\u00e6\u00f0i. Mikilv\u00e6gt atri\u00f0i fyrir honum er skilgreiningin hva\u00f0 vi\u00f0 teljum vera einingu.<br \/>\nsvo \u00e9g taki beint upp\u00far b\u00f3kinni:<br \/>\n00 \u00a0 000 \u00a0 \u00a0 00 \u00a0 \u00a0 \u00a00000 \u00a0 \u00a0 00 \u00a0 000<br \/>\nL\u00edkt og s\u00e9st \u00ed d\u00e6minu h\u00e9r a\u00f0 ofan er bil st\u00f3r partur af \u00fev\u00ed a\u00f0 vi\u00f0 teljum hluti vera hluti af einingu e\u00f0a ekki, Tenney skilgreinir svo bil sem t\u00edma.<\/p>\n<p>Tenney vir\u00f0ist ekki vera miki\u00f0 a\u00f0 sp\u00e1 \u00ed hvernig r\u00f6\u00f0 atbur\u00f0a skipti m\u00e1li (sem bo\u00f0fr\u00e6\u00f0ileg a\u00f0koma myndi gera) heldur hvernig hann getur alh\u00e6ft um a\u00f0 hlutir s\u00e9u eins og ekki, a\u00f0 \u00fea\u00f0 s\u00e9 \u00ed raun s\u00e1lfr\u00e6\u00f0ilega h\u00e6gt a\u00f0 segja a\u00f0 hlutir geti veri\u00f0 mismunandi. \u00deetta er virkilega skemmtilega p\u00f3s\u00edt\u00edv tilraun.<\/p><\/div>\n<\/td>\n<\/tr>\n<\/tbody>\n<\/table>\n<\/div>\n<div>\n<div>\n<div>\n<div><a href=\"http:\/\/s-l-a-t-u-r.2169095.n2.nabble.com\/template\/NamlServlet.jtp?macro=user_nodes&amp;user=tervel-3146947%7EDavid+Brynjar+Franzson\">David Brynjar Franzson<\/a><\/div>\n<div><img decoding=\"async\" loading=\"lazy\" title=\"Selected post\" src=\"http:\/\/s-l-a-t-u-r.2169095.n2.nabble.com\/images\/arrow.png\" alt=\"Selected post\" width=\"15\" height=\"15\" \/> Mar 10, 2009; 1:43pm<script type=\"text\/javascript\">\/\/ <![CDATA[\/\/ <![CDATA[\n\t\tNabble.get('d1236692630667-755').innerHTML= Nabble.formatDateLong(new Date(1236692630667));\n\n\/\/ ]]><\/script><\/p>\n<h2>Re: Tungum\u00e1l\/uppl\u00fdsingar og skynjun<\/h2>\n<\/div>\n<div><a rel=\"nofollow\" href=\"http:\/\/s-l-a-t-u-r.2169095.n2.nabble.com\/template\/NamlServlet.jtp?macro=reply&amp;node=2455236\">Reply<\/a> | \t\t\t\t\t<a onclick=\"Nabble.setView('threaded', 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mestu um merkinguna og heg\u00f0un or\u00f0a. \u00deegar \u00e9g segi a\u00f0 t\u00f3nlist s\u00e9 ekki tungum\u00e1l \u00fe\u00e1 er \u00e9g ekki endilega a\u00f0 segja a\u00f0 ekki v\u00e6ri h\u00e6gt a\u00f0 \u00fer\u00f3a fullgylt tungum\u00e1l me\u00f0 t\u00f3nlist, bara a\u00f0 t\u00f3nlist er ekki automat\u00edskt a priori tungum\u00e1l og a\u00f0 enn sem komi\u00f0 er s\u00e9 ekki til eitt einasta d\u00e6mi \u00fear sem einhver sub-t\u00fdpa af t\u00f3nlist uppfyllir \u00feau skilyr\u00f0i sem \u00feurfa a\u00f0 liggja til grundvallar tungum\u00e1li.<\/p>\n<p>Svo er l\u00edka spurning um hvort vi\u00f0 myndum yfir h\u00f6fu\u00f0 skynja tungum\u00e1l b\u00fai\u00f0 til \u00far t\u00f3nlist sem t\u00f3nlist, e\u00f0a hvort pr\u00f3sessinn a\u00f0 l\u00e6ra \u00fea\u00f0 sem tungum\u00e1l myndi hafa teki\u00f0 yfir. Einn helsti styrkur (betri) t\u00f3nlistar er hvernig signifier og signified eru eitt og \u00fea\u00f0 sama, \u00feeir standa ekki fyrir neitt, eru ekki referential heldur eru einn og sami hluturinn.<\/p>\n<p>Fyrir \u00fe\u00e1 sem vilja sko\u00f0a paralinguistics \u00fe\u00e1 er mest rannsaka\u00f0i fyrirb\u00e6ri\u00f0 oftast kalla\u00f0 prosody \u00feannig a\u00f0 \u00fea\u00f0 er gott leitaror\u00f0 \u00e1 google scholar.<\/p>\n<p>(\u00dea\u00f0 sem fylgir er meira um cognition, er alveg samm\u00e1la Tenney hva\u00f0 var\u00f0ar a\u00f0 bil skeri \u00e1 milli hluta \u00ed perception. \u00c9g vill l\u00edka taka fram a\u00f0 h\u00e9r er \u00e9g a\u00f0 tala um margar misv\u00edsandi kenningar sem ganga ekki allar saman upp svo sumt g\u00e6ti veri\u00f0 r\u00e9tt en anna\u00f0 misv\u00edsindi sem eiga eftir a\u00f0 vera afs\u00f6nnu\u00f0).<\/p>\n<p>\u00dea\u00f0 er s\u00ed\u00f0an n\u00e1tt\u00farulega h\u00e6gt a\u00f0 vinna me\u00f0 \u00fea\u00f0 a\u00f0 skilgreina og endurskilgreina hvernig vi\u00f0 greinum \u00e1 milli hlj\u00f3\u00f0a, hva\u00f0 s\u00e9 sama eining og hva\u00f0 ekki. H\u00e9r koma inn \u00ed spurninguna hlutir eins og Perceptual Threshold sem er kenning um \u00fea\u00f0 a\u00f0 \u00ed sta\u00f0in fyrir a\u00f0 vi\u00f0 h\u00f6fum gestalt sem vi\u00f0 berum allt saman vi\u00f0 til a\u00f0 \u00feekkja hluti, \u00fe\u00e1 s\u00e9 frekar til sta\u00f0ar mengi af eiginleikum sem vi\u00f0 tengjum \u00e1kve\u00f0nu concepti. T.d. er gluggi me\u00f0 gler og a\u00f0 mestu gagns\u00e6r og \u00e6tla\u00f0ur til a\u00f0 hleypa byrtu \u00ed gegnum. Sama \u00e1 vi\u00f0 um tr\u00e9. Vi\u00f0 vitum hva\u00f0 helstu eiginleikar (properties) af tr\u00e9 eru \u00feannig a\u00f0 vi\u00f0 getum \u00feekkt tr\u00e9 fr\u00e1 bl\u00f3mi. Tr\u00e9 og bl\u00f3m hafa fullt af sameiginlegum eiginleikum en \u00fea\u00f0 eru bara \u00f6rf\u00e1ir sem a\u00f0skilja \u00feau. \u00dea\u00f0 eiginleikamengi er \u00fea\u00f0 sem vi\u00f0 n\u00fdtum \u00fe\u00e1 til a\u00f0 \u00feekkja hluti \u00ed sundur. Samkv\u00e6mt gamalli gestalt fr\u00e6\u00f0i \u00fe\u00e1 v\u00e6ri \u00feetta eiginleika mengi gestalt tr\u00e9s, en samkv\u00e6mt &#8220;n\u00fdrri&#8221; fr\u00e6\u00f0um eins og perceptual thresholding og category perception, \u00fe\u00e1 er \u00fea\u00f0 sem m\u00e1li skiptir ekki hva\u00f0 er \u00ed menginu, heldur hvar m\u00f6rkin \u00e1 milli mengja liggja. Einhversta\u00f0ar eru til skil (threshold) sem sker \u00ed gegnum allar percept\u00faal v\u00edddir sem skipta m\u00e1li til a\u00f0 skilja \u00e1 milli tr\u00e9s og bl\u00f3ms. \u00deessi skil eru \u00e1 hinn bogin ekki f\u00f6st heldur er h\u00e6gt a\u00f0 vinna me\u00f0 a\u00f0 b\u00faa til n\u00fd og f\u00e6ra g\u00f6mul. Vi\u00f0 l\u00e6rum \u00fe\u00e1 me\u00f0 \u00fev\u00ed a\u00f0 taka mengi og skipta \u00fev\u00ed upp \u00ed fleiri minni mengi \u00feegar n\u00fd skil ver\u00f0a til. \u00deetta er n\u00e1tt\u00farulega ekki alveg laust fr\u00e1 hirearchiu \u00fev\u00ed \u00feetta ver\u00f0ur allt saman nesta\u00f0 \u00e1 endanum. T.d. er h\u00e6gt a\u00f0 \u00fdminda s\u00e9r tvo gula liti sem eru svo l\u00edkir a\u00f0 ma\u00f0ur \u00feekkir \u00fe\u00e1 ekki \u00ed sundur nema a\u00f0 ma\u00f0ur sj\u00e1i \u00fe\u00e1 hli\u00f0 vi\u00f0 hli\u00f0. \u00dea\u00f0 er alls ekki v\u00edst a\u00f0 s\u00fa categorization haldi \u00feegar ma\u00f0ur svo b\u00e6tur sv\u00f6rtum lit inn \u00e1 milli \u00ed ser\u00edu, t.d. gult1, svart, gult2, svart, gult2, gult1, svart, nema \u00feegar tveir gulu litirnir standa saman. Skilin eru mj\u00f6g l\u00e1g \u00e1 milli \u00feeirra en samt n\u00e6g til a\u00f0 \u00feekkja hlutina \u00ed sundur.<\/p>\n<p>\u00dearna kemur context inn \u00ed myndina og \u00fea\u00f0 er kl\u00e1rlega lj\u00f3st a\u00f0 samhengi\u00f0 sem hlutur byrtist \u00ed getur haft \u00e1hrif \u00e1 \u00fev\u00ed hva\u00f0 hann er flokka\u00f0ur sem. Svo koma l\u00edka inn \u00ed \u00feetta hin eil\u00edfu semantics (baul) \u00fear sem \u00fea\u00f0 sem vi\u00f0 erum v\u00f6n \u00ed samhenginu hefur \u00e1hrif \u00e1 hvernig vi\u00f0 skynjum eitthva\u00f0. T.d. \u00fe\u00e1 er l\u00edklegt a\u00f0 or\u00f0skilningur tengist \u00feessu. \u00dea\u00f0 er ekki s\u00e9ns a\u00f0 heilinn n\u00e1i a\u00f0 fara \u00ed gegnum \u00f6ll mengi af m\u00f6gulegum permutationum af raddbeytingu og hreim til a\u00f0 finna \u00fat hva\u00f0a or\u00f0 eitthva\u00f0 sem eyra\u00f0 heyrir er. \u00cd sta\u00f0in er l\u00edklegt a\u00f0 einhverskonar framreiknandi &#8212; e\u00f0a bakreiknandi &#8212; kerfi s\u00e9 \u00ed gangi sem f\u00e6kki m\u00f6guleikunum samkv\u00e6mt samhenginu. H\u00e9r v\u00e6ri l\u00edka sennilegast a\u00f0 til sta\u00f0ar s\u00e9 einhverkonar kerfi sem leytar eftir \u00fev\u00ed sem er invariant \u00ed hlj\u00f3\u00f0inu frekar en a\u00f0 \u00fea\u00f0 noti thresholding. \u00deessi hugmynd gerir r\u00e1\u00f0 fyrir \u00fev\u00ed a\u00f0 til s\u00e9 einhverskonar \u00fej\u00f6ppun sem b\u00fai til einfalda \u00fatg\u00e1fu af signalinu sem kemur inn \u00ed skynf\u00e6rin sem s\u00e9 svo h\u00e6gt a\u00f0 nota til a\u00f0 bera saman vi\u00f0 gagnabanka heilans. \u00de\u00e1 v\u00e6ri sem sagt til einhverskonar structural isomorphismi (sem eftir \u00fev\u00ed sem \u00e9g kemst n\u00e6st \u00fe\u00fd\u00f0ir a\u00f0 \u00ed kerfi B s\u00e9u til einfalda\u00f0ir factorar sem hafi s\u00f6mu tengsl s\u00edn \u00e1 milli og er til sta\u00f0ar \u00ed kerfi A, t.d. er structural isomorphismi \u00e1 milli hlj\u00f3\u00f0bylgju og wavefile af sama hlj\u00f3\u00f0i, uppl\u00fdsingarnar \u00ed einu kerfi hafa veri\u00f0 m\u00f3d\u00falera\u00f0ar yfir \u00ed anna\u00f0 kerfi og \u00fev\u00ed sem m\u00e1li skiptir haldi\u00f0 eftir).<\/p>\n<p>\u00dea\u00f0 er ekkert sem segir a\u00f0 \u00f6ll \u00feessi kerfi s\u00e9u ekki \u00ed gangi \u00e1 sama t\u00edma. Heilinn er mass\u00edf parallel reikniv\u00e9l og vi\u00f0 erum rosalega l\u00ednulega hugsandi og erum enn ekki b\u00fana\u00f0 skilja hva\u00f0 getur yfir h\u00f6fu\u00f0 gerst \u00ed sl\u00edkum kerfum.<\/p><\/div>\n<\/td>\n<\/tr>\n<\/tbody>\n<\/table>\n<\/div>\n<div>\n<div>\n<div>\n<div><a href=\"http:\/\/s-l-a-t-u-r.2169095.n2.nabble.com\/template\/NamlServlet.jtp?macro=user_nodes&amp;user=tervel-2900087%7EGu%C3%B0mundur+Steinn+Gunnarsson\">Gu\u00f0mundur Steinn Gunnarsson<\/a><\/div>\n<div><img decoding=\"async\" loading=\"lazy\" title=\"Selected post\" src=\"http:\/\/s-l-a-t-u-r.2169095.n2.nabble.com\/images\/arrow.png\" alt=\"Selected post\" width=\"15\" height=\"15\" \/> Mar 10, 2009; 3:30pm<script type=\"text\/javascript\">\/\/ <![CDATA[\/\/ <![CDATA[\n\t\tNabble.get('d1236699049600-747').innerHTML= Nabble.formatDateLong(new Date(1236699049600));\n\n\/\/ ]]><\/script><\/p>\n<h2>Re: Tungum\u00e1l\/uppl\u00fdsingar og skynjun<\/h2>\n<\/div>\n<div><a rel=\"nofollow\" 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Steinn Gunnarsson\" width=\"100\" height=\"100\" \/><img decoding=\"async\" title=\"User is online\" src=\"http:\/\/s-l-a-t-u-r.2169095.n2.nabble.com\/images\/online.png\" alt=\"online\" \/><\/a><\/div>\n<\/div>\n<\/td>\n<td>\n<div>\u00c9g veit ekki hver er hin almenna hef\u00f0 \u00ed Gestalt s\u00e1lfr\u00e6\u00f0i en Tenney kemur inn \u00e1 margt fleira en bil, t.d. breytingar \u00e1 parametrum, og ef litlar breytingar eru \u00e1 m\u00f6rgum parametrum \u00ed einu er \u00fea\u00f0 jafn mikil breyting og ein drast\u00edsk breyting \u00e1 einum parameter. Hann minnist l\u00edka \u00e1 samhengi\u00f0, semsagt a\u00f0 \u00feegar n\u00fdtt element kemur inn sem er \u00f3l\u00edkt \u00feeim sem voru \u00e1 undan ver\u00f0a \u00feau l\u00edkari og \u00f6fugt, eins og \u00fe\u00fa talar um. \u00c9g veit ekki hvort \u00feetta eru bara p\u00e6lingar komnar fr\u00e1 Tenney e\u00f0a hvort \u00fe\u00e6r eigi s\u00e9r f\u00f3tfestu \u00ed Gestalt s\u00e1lfr\u00e6\u00f0i. \u00dea\u00f0 eru alla vega einhverjir sameiginlegir hlekkir vi\u00f0 perceptual threshold, s\u00fdnist m\u00e9r, en \u00e9g veit ekki miki\u00f0 um \u00fea\u00f0 og v\u00e6ri til \u00ed a\u00f0 kynna m\u00e9r \u00fea\u00f0. M\u00e9r finnst margt mj\u00f6g \u00e1hugavert \u00ed Tenney \u00feeor\u00edunni \u00fe\u00f3 margt hafi eflaust gerst s\u00ed\u00f0an \u00fe\u00e1 sem \u00e9g \u00feekki ekki eins vel og v\u00e6ri til \u00ed a\u00f0 vita meira um svona s\u00e1lfr\u00e6\u00f0ip\u00e6lingar eins og Dav\u00ed\u00f0 hefur nota\u00f0 \u00ed ritger\u00f0um s\u00ednum. Gallinn vi\u00f0 Tenney er a\u00f0 \u00feetta segir bara takmarka\u00f0 miki\u00f0 um t\u00f3nlistina. \u00deetta segir hverjar byggingareiningarnar eru og er algj\u00f6rlega hlutl\u00e6gt hva\u00f0 st\u00edl e\u00f0a t\u00f3nsm\u00ed\u00f0aa\u00f0fer\u00f0 var\u00f0ar (e\u00f0a, fer eftir \u00fev\u00ed hvernig a\u00f0fer\u00f0inni er beitt) en kemst \u00ed sj\u00e1lfu s\u00e9r ekkert lengra, e\u00f0a enginn hefur haldi\u00f0 \u00e1fram me\u00f0 \u00feessa p\u00e6lingu nema Tenney sj\u00e1lfur og Polansky. En \u00e1 s\u00ednum t\u00edma var engin t\u00f3nlistarleg fr\u00e6\u00f0i sem gekk ekki fyrst \u00fat fr\u00e1 pitchi og t\u00f3num og svo \u00f6llu \u00f6\u00f0ru. Eftir t\u00f3nlistar\u00fer\u00f3un s\u00ed\u00f0ari \u00e1ra hefur \u00feetta or\u00f0i\u00f0 meira a\u00f0kallandi.<br \/>\nEinir sem s\u00f3ttu \u00ed \u00feessar p\u00e6lingar Tenney\u00b4s voru Fred Lerdahl og Ray Jackendorff \u00ed hinni fr\u00e6gu og umdeildu b\u00f3k Generative Theory of Tonal Music. Form\u00e1li b\u00f3karinnar segir margt sem segja \u00fearf um leimni b\u00f3karinnar, Leonard Bernstein benti \u00e1 a\u00f0 h\u00e6gt v\u00e6ri a\u00f0 nota a\u00f0fer\u00f0ir Chomsky\u00b4s til a\u00f0 greina t\u00f3nlist og \u00ed kj\u00f6lfari\u00f0 \u00e1kv\u00e1\u00f0u piltarnir a\u00f0 fara a\u00f0 gera m\u00e1lfr\u00e6\u00f0ilega st\u00fad\u00edu \u00e1 t\u00f3nalm\u00fas\u00edk. Eins og \u00der\u00e1inn sag\u00f0i a\u00f0 \u00fe\u00e1 s\u00e9 h\u00e6gt a\u00f0 anal\u00fdsa alls kyns \u00fat \u00far funksj\u00f3num t\u00f3nal t\u00f3nlistar. \u00cd GTTM eru settar alls konar m\u00e1lfr\u00e6\u00f0ireglur um \u00fea\u00f0 hvernig t\u00f3nal t\u00f3nlist virkar og einhverjir endurhanna\u00f0 \u00fe\u00e6r til \u00feess a\u00f0 fjalla um a\u00f0ra t\u00f3nlist e\u00f0a finna kerfin \u00ed \u00feeim. M\u00e9r finnst margt \u00e1hugavert \u00ed \u00feessu en samt eitthva\u00f0 rangt l\u00edka sem erfitt er a\u00f0 segja hva\u00f0 er. Sj\u00e1lfur er \u00e9g miki\u00f0 fyrir fimbulfambs\u00feumalputtareglur \u00ed m\u00ednum t\u00f3nsm\u00ed\u00f0aa\u00f0fer\u00f0um en spurningin er hvort reglur s\u00e9u alfari\u00f0 r\u00e9tta lei\u00f0in til a\u00f0 \u00fatsk\u00fdra \u00fer\u00f3un t\u00f3nlistar, \u00ed sta\u00f0 t.d. einhvers konar t\u00f6lfr\u00e6\u00f0i, e\u00f0a l\u00edkinda \u00e1 a\u00f0 \u00e1kve\u00f0nir hlutir gerist frekar en a\u00f0rir. \u00c9g held samt a\u00f0 \u00feeir s\u00e9u ekki a\u00f0 segja a\u00f0 t\u00f3nlist s\u00e9 tungum\u00e1l, eins bj\u00e1nalega og \u00e9g var a\u00f0 segja (\u00e9g hef\u00f0i n\u00fa haldi\u00f0 a\u00f0 \u00fea\u00f0 v\u00e6ri ekkert signified \u00ed t\u00f3nlist, heldur bara signifyerar). En \u00fea\u00f0 eru margar \u00e1hugaver\u00f0ar saml\u00edkingar h\u00e6gt a\u00f0 finna ef \u00fe\u00e6r eru ekki teknar of alvarlega. T.d. var Saussare-gamli me\u00f0 \u00fe\u00e1 kenningu a\u00f0 hlj\u00f3\u00f0 \u00feyrftu a\u00f0 mynda andst\u00e6\u00f0ur og \u00fea\u00f0 yr\u00f0i l\u00f3g\u00edgin \u00ed signifyera kerfinu frekar en hvort hlj\u00f3\u00f0in tengdust hinu signif\u00e6ja\u00f0a beint. \u00deetta finnst m\u00e9r eiga vi\u00f0 um marga t\u00f3nlist, \u00fea\u00f0 \u00fearf bara ekki a\u00f0 minnast \u00e1 \u201ehi\u00f0 merkta\u201c e\u00f0a the signified \u00fev\u00ed \u00fea\u00f0 er \u00ed raun ekki til, nema \u00fea\u00f0 s\u00e9 \u00fea\u00f0 sama eins og Dav\u00ed\u00f0 segir.<br \/>\nEn fram hafa komi\u00f0 samskonar hugmyndir til \u00feess a\u00f0 fjalla fr\u00e6\u00f0ilega um t\u00f3nlist \u00f3h\u00e1\u00f0 \u00fev\u00ed a\u00f0 byrja \u00e1 a\u00f0 greina t\u00f3na og t\u00f3nasamhengi auk \u00feess sem \u00fea\u00f0 \u00e1 minna og minna vi\u00f0 um t\u00f3nlistina. \u00deess vegna vildi \u00e9g koma af sta\u00f0 \u00feessari umr\u00e6\u00f0u til a\u00f0 bera saman samb\u00e6rilega hluti \u00ed mismunandi paradigmum (GTTM, Meta-hodos, Perceptual Threshold, Bo\u00f0fr\u00e6\u00f0i og eflaust eitthva\u00f0 fleira).<\/p>\n<\/div>\n<\/td>\n<\/tr>\n<\/tbody>\n<\/table>\n<\/div>\n<div>\n<div>\n<div>\n<div><a href=\"http:\/\/s-l-a-t-u-r.2169095.n2.nabble.com\/template\/NamlServlet.jtp?macro=user_nodes&amp;user=253744\">David Brynjar Franzson<\/a><\/div>\n<div><img decoding=\"async\" loading=\"lazy\" title=\"Selected post\" src=\"http:\/\/s-l-a-t-u-r.2169095.n2.nabble.com\/images\/arrow.png\" alt=\"Selected post\" width=\"15\" height=\"15\" \/> Mar 10, 2009; 5:31pm<script type=\"text\/javascript\">\/\/ <![CDATA[\/\/ <![CDATA[\n\t\tNabble.get('d1236706296641-946').innerHTML= Nabble.formatDateLong(new Date(1236706296641));\n\n\/\/ ]]><\/script><\/p>\n<h2>Re: Tungum\u00e1l\/uppl\u00fdsingar og skynjun<\/h2>\n<\/div>\n<div><a rel=\"nofollow\" href=\"http:\/\/s-l-a-t-u-r.2169095.n2.nabble.com\/template\/NamlServlet.jtp?macro=reply&amp;node=2456681\">Reply<\/a> | \t\t\t\t\t<a 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src=\"http:\/\/www.gravatar.com\/avatar\/ca09108239e42e779637df57c89a8cce?s=100&amp;r=pg&amp;d=http%3A%2F%2Fn2.nabble.com%2Fimages%2Favatar100.png\" alt=\"David Brynjar Franzson\" width=\"100\" height=\"100\" \/><img decoding=\"async\" title=\"User is online\" src=\"http:\/\/s-l-a-t-u-r.2169095.n2.nabble.com\/images\/online.png\" alt=\"online\" \/><\/a><\/div>\n<\/div>\n<div>18 posts<\/div>\n<\/td>\n<td>\n<div>Hva\u00f0 var\u00f0ar \u00fea\u00f0 a\u00f0 Tenney e\u00f0a Gestalt e\u00f0a hinar og \u00feessar 80\u00b4s cognitivar kenningar \u00fe\u00e1 er \u00e9g ekki viss um a\u00f0 \u00fea\u00f0 s\u00e9 sl\u00e6mt a\u00f0 \u00fe\u00e6r segi ekkert til um t\u00f3nlistina. \u00c9g er kannski svona v\u00edsinda p\u00f3m\u00f3 en m\u00e9r finnst \u00fea\u00f0 bara einfaldlega gott a\u00f0 \u00fea\u00f0 s\u00e9 h\u00e6gt a\u00f0 finna eitthva\u00f0 s\u00e1lfr\u00e6\u00f0ilegt sem var\u00f0ar t\u00f3nlist sem segir samt ekkert fyrir um hva\u00f0 s\u00e9 gott e\u00f0a vont. \u00dea\u00f0 er gott a\u00f0 h\u00e6gt er a\u00f0 finna s\u00e1lfr\u00e6\u00f0ilega \u00fatsk\u00fdringu \u00e1 afhverju b\u00e6\u00f0i Feldman og Beethoven &#8220;virka&#8221; og enn\u00fe\u00e1 betra a\u00f0 h\u00fan segir \u00feannig laga\u00f0 s\u00e9\u00f0 l\u00edti\u00f0 til um hvernig ma\u00f0ur gerir enn\u00fe\u00e1 betra (ekkert a\u00f0 \u00fatiloka a\u00f0 \u00fea\u00f0 s\u00e9 h\u00e6gt a\u00f0 finna \u00fea\u00f0 \u00fat, meira a\u00f0 meina \u00fat fr\u00e1 \u00fev\u00ed sem b\u00fai\u00f0 er a\u00f0 gera).<\/p>\n<p>L\u00edka var\u00f0andi n\u00fdjungar e\u00f0a ekki n\u00fdjungar \u00fe\u00e1 var\u00f0 Gestalt hall\u00e6rislegt og hvarf, en n\u00fana er a\u00f0 koma \u00ed lj\u00f3s a\u00f0 fullt af grunnhugmyndunum voru ekkert svo vitlausar heldur a\u00f0allega heimspekilega n\u00e1lgunin. \u00deetta er eiginlega einhverskonar s\u00e1lfr\u00e6\u00f0i phenomenology sem er n\u00e1tt\u00farulega p\u00ednu heimsk yfirlitshugmynd, en margt \u00ed ranns\u00f3knunum og ni\u00f0urst\u00f6\u00f0unum er gilt, bara betra a\u00f0 \u00fatsk\u00fdra \u00fea\u00f0 \u00f6\u00f0ruv\u00edsi. Gestalt er ein af bestu \u00fatsk\u00fdringara\u00f0fer\u00f0unum \u00feegar kemur a\u00f0 t\u00f3nlist og heilanum, en er sennilega ekki miki\u00f0 meira en g\u00f3\u00f0 \u00feumalputtaregla.<\/p>\n<p>Hva\u00f0 var\u00f0ar tungum\u00e1l \u00fe\u00e1 er engin samhlj\u00f3mur \u00fear heldur um \u00fea\u00f0 hvort \u00fea\u00f0 s\u00e9 \u00ed raun r\u00e9tt a\u00f0 hugsa um or\u00f0r\u00f6\u00f0 og a\u00f0ra m\u00e1lfr\u00e6\u00f0i \u00fat fr\u00e1 reglum. \u00cd ensku \u00fearf c.a. 700 reglur til a\u00f0 r\u00e9ttl\u00e6ta hverngi tungum\u00e1li\u00f0 virkar en \u00fea\u00f0 er au\u00f0veldlega h\u00e6gt a\u00f0 gera &#8220;einf\u00f6ld&#8221; stat\u00edt\u00edsk m\u00f3del sem eru mun l\u00e9ttari \u00ed notkun eftir a\u00f0 \u00feau hafa upphaflega l\u00e6rt tungum\u00e1li\u00f0 og n\u00e1 yfir 95% getu \u00ed a\u00f0 lesa og skrifa. \u00dea\u00f0 er andskoti erfitt a\u00f0 keyra 700 reglur \u00e1 tungum\u00e1l sem hefur kannski 50.000 or\u00f0. \u00dearnar kemur inn\u00ed \u00fea\u00f0 sem Gu\u00f0mundur kallar fimbulfambs\u00feumalputtareglur og \u00e9g kalla\u00f0i methodologiu \u00ed \u00f6\u00f0rum \u00fer\u00e6\u00f0i. \u00dea\u00f0 g\u00e6ti veri\u00f0 meira effekt\u00edft a\u00f0 nota fyrst t\u00f6lfr\u00e6\u00f0i til a\u00f0 framlei\u00f0a kand\u00eddat af m\u00f6gulegum or\u00f0um og svo einfaldar \u00feumalputtareglur til a\u00f0 laga m\u00e1lfr\u00e6\u00f0ilega framvindu. \u00dea\u00f0 t\u00e6ki \u00e1r og aldir a\u00f0 synthesera sl\u00edkt upp fr\u00e1 reglunum einum saman. Ein spurning \u00ed reiknilegum m\u00e1lv\u00edsindum er einmitt hva\u00f0 s\u00e9 h\u00e6gt a\u00f0 komast vel framhj\u00e1 reglum yfir h\u00f6fu\u00f0, og svari\u00f0 vir\u00f0ist vera &#8220;ansi langt&#8221;.<\/p>\n<p>Ef vi\u00f0 \u00fdmindum okkur \u00feetta yfir \u00e1 t\u00f3nlist \u00fe\u00e1 er alveg hugsanlegt a\u00f0 \u00fea\u00f0 a\u00f0 hafa konsistant vi\u00f0br\u00f6g\u00f0 e\u00f0a a\u00f0fer\u00f0ir til a\u00f0 b\u00faa til e\u00f0a breg\u00f0ast vi\u00f0 mismunandi situationum \u00e1n \u00feess a\u00f0 hafa fullkomi\u00f0 reglukerfi e\u00f0a hreint konsept geti framleitt &#8220;r\u00e9tta&#8221; t\u00f3nlist. \u00datkoman er mess\u00ed t\u00f3nlist \u00fear sem \u00e1kvar\u00f0anir eru teknar mi\u00f0a\u00f0 vi\u00f0 \u00fe\u00e1 st\u00f6\u00f0u sem upp er komin frekar en \u00fat fr\u00e1 fyrirfram gefnu skema e\u00f0a samkv\u00e6mt h\u00f6nnun. Sennilega myndu einhverjir vilja meina a\u00f0 \u00feetta s\u00e9 bullandi subjektivismi, en ef methodologiunni er beitt af fullri h\u00f6rku til a\u00f0 \u00ferengja m\u00f6guleikana \u00ed st\u00f6\u00f0unni og a\u00f0sto\u00f0a vi\u00f0 \u00e1kvar\u00f0anat\u00f6ku, og ef henni er beytt eins \u00ed skildum a\u00f0st\u00e6\u00f0um, \u00fe\u00e1 \u00e6tti \u00fatkoman a\u00f0 vera &#8220;r\u00e9tt&#8221; t\u00f3nlistaryfirbor\u00f0 \u00fe\u00f3 svo \u00fea\u00f0 s\u00e9 ekki h\u00e6gt a\u00f0 einfalda \u00fea\u00f0 ni\u00f0ur \u00ed m\u00e1lfr\u00e6\u00f0ireglur.<\/p>\n<p>\u00deetta er allt sama alveg sullandi \u00f3lj\u00f3st held \u00e9g.<\/p><\/div>\n<\/td>\n<\/tr>\n<\/tbody>\n<\/table>\n<\/div>\n<div>\n<div>\n<div>\n<div><a href=\"http:\/\/s-l-a-t-u-r.2169095.n2.nabble.com\/template\/NamlServlet.jtp?macro=user_nodes&amp;user=tervel-2900087%7EGu%C3%B0mundur+Steinn+Gunnarsson\">Gu\u00f0mundur Steinn Gunnarsson<\/a><\/div>\n<div><img decoding=\"async\" loading=\"lazy\" title=\"Selected post\" src=\"http:\/\/s-l-a-t-u-r.2169095.n2.nabble.com\/images\/arrow.png\" alt=\"Selected post\" width=\"15\" height=\"15\" \/> Mar 11, 2009; 12:46pm<script type=\"text\/javascript\">\/\/ <![CDATA[\/\/ <![CDATA[\n\t\tNabble.get('d1236775602917-790').innerHTML= Nabble.formatDateLong(new Date(1236775602917));\n\n\/\/ ]]><\/script><\/p>\n<h2>Re: Tungum\u00e1l\/uppl\u00fdsingar og skynjun<\/h2>\n<\/div>\n<div><a rel=\"nofollow\" href=\"http:\/\/s-l-a-t-u-r.2169095.n2.nabble.com\/template\/NamlServlet.jtp?macro=reply&amp;node=2461137\">Reply<\/a> | \t\t\t\t\t<a onclick=\"Nabble.setView('threaded', '\/Tungumal-uppl-singar-og-skynjun-tt2445110.html#a2461137',null)\" href=\"javascript:void(0)\">Threaded<\/a> | \t\t\t\t\t<a title=\"Click for more options\" href=\"javascript:void(0)\">More<\/a> <img decoding=\"async\" loading=\"lazy\" title=\"Click for more options\" src=\"http:\/\/s-l-a-t-u-r.2169095.n2.nabble.com\/images\/more.png\" alt=\"\" width=\"10\" height=\"10\" 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\/><\/div>\n<\/div>\n<\/div>\n<table>\n<tbody>\n<tr>\n<td>\n<div>\n<div><a title=\"View profile of Gu\u00f0mundur Steinn Gunnarsson\" rel=\"nofollow\" href=\"http:\/\/s-l-a-t-u-r.2169095.n2.nabble.com\/template\/NamlServlet.jtp?macro=user_nodes&amp;user=tervel-2900087%7EGu%C3%B0mundur+Steinn+Gunnarsson\"><img decoding=\"async\" loading=\"lazy\" title=\"Gu\u00f0mundur Steinn Gunnarsson\" src=\"http:\/\/n2.nabble.com\/images\/avatar100.png\" alt=\"Gu\u00f0mundur Steinn Gunnarsson\" width=\"100\" height=\"100\" \/><img decoding=\"async\" title=\"User is online\" src=\"http:\/\/s-l-a-t-u-r.2169095.n2.nabble.com\/images\/online.png\" alt=\"online\" \/><\/a><\/div>\n<\/div>\n<\/td>\n<td>\n<div>En \u00fea\u00f0 sem \u00e9g meinti me\u00f0 \u00fev\u00ed a\u00f0 \u00fea\u00f0 vanta\u00f0i eitthva\u00f0 \u00ed kenningar Tenney&#8217;s er bara a\u00f0 \u00fe\u00e6r n\u00e1 bara \u00e1kve\u00f0i\u00f0 langt. \u00de\u00e1 meinti \u00e9g ekki a\u00f0 \u00fe\u00e6r fari ekki n\u00f3gu langt inn \u00e1 hlutdr\u00e6gt \u00a0svi\u00f0. Semsagt, \u00fe\u00e6r gera r\u00e1\u00f0 fyrir a\u00f0 ma\u00f0ur viti ekkert um t\u00f3nsk\u00f6punara\u00f0fer\u00f0 og bara eins og ma\u00f0ur s\u00e9 a\u00f0 sko\u00f0a fjall, hva\u00f0 er einn tindur, hva\u00f0 s\u00e9r ma\u00f0ur sem n\u00e6sta og svolei\u00f0is. \u00dea\u00f0 sem \u00e9g \u00e1 vi\u00f0 er a\u00f0 \u00fea\u00f0 g\u00e6ti veri\u00f0 h\u00e6gt a\u00f0 b\u00faa til s\u00e9rh\u00e6f\u00f0ari sl\u00edk kerfi sem tala um virkni \u00feess \u00e1 minni\u00f0 \u00ed hva\u00f0a r\u00f6\u00f0 hlutir koma og n\u00e1kv\u00e6mari \u00fatlistanir \u00e1 alls konar skynjunarlegum fyrirb\u00e6rum, ekki a\u00f0 \u00fea\u00f0 eigi a\u00f0 fara \u00fat \u00ed a\u00f0 segja endilega meira hlutdr\u00e6ga hluti, \u00fev\u00ed \u00fea\u00f0 getur ma\u00f0ur gert sj\u00e1lfur og er til fullt af g\u00f6mlum a\u00f0fer\u00f0um til a\u00f0 sko\u00f0a.<\/p>\n<p>En n\u00fa \u00feegar komi\u00f0 hafa fram alls kyns hlutir sem vi\u00f0 Dav\u00ed\u00f0 h\u00f6fum \u00e1\u00f0ur r\u00e6tt \u00fe\u00e1 langar mig a\u00f0 spyrja Dav\u00ed\u00f0 \u00fat \u00ed setningu sem hann svara\u00f0i m\u00e9r aldrei um \u00ed ritger\u00f0inni sinni. \u00dear sag\u00f0ist hann ekki hafa \u00e1huga \u00e1 a\u00f0 b\u00faa til tungum\u00e1l \u00ed m\u00f3menti verksins (ef \u00e9g skildi \u00fea\u00f0 r\u00e9tt) og mig langa\u00f0i a\u00f0 spyrja n\u00e1kv\u00e6mlega hva\u00f0 h\u00f6fundurinn meinti. Hversu n\u00e1kv\u00e6m er notku or\u00f0sins tungum\u00e1l. \u00c9g hef sj\u00e1lfur mj\u00f6g mikinn \u00e1huga \u00e1 \u201etungum\u00e1lum\u201c sem eru skilgreind \u00ed verki \u00e1 me\u00f0an \u00fev\u00ed stendur, b\u00e6\u00f0i \u00ed m\u00ednum t\u00f3nsm\u00ed\u00f0um og hj\u00e1 sk\u00e1ldum eins og Morton Feldman og Donatoni og fleirum, \u00fear sem minni\u00f0 er nota\u00f0 og merkimi\u00f0ar settir \u00e1 einingar me\u00f0 endurtekningum.<\/p>\n<p>A. Finnst Dav\u00ed\u00f0 svona laga\u00f0 \u00f3\u00e1hugavert e\u00f0a barnalegt (e\u00f0a bara ekki eiga vi\u00f0)<br \/>\ne\u00f0a<br \/>\nB. Er \u00e9g a\u00f0 misskilja skilgreiningar Dav\u00ed\u00f0s<br \/>\ne\u00f0a<br \/>\nC. \u00de\u00f3 a\u00f0 t\u00f3nlistin sem Dav\u00ed\u00f0 er a\u00f0 gera reyni a\u00f0 brj\u00f3ta ni\u00f0ur alla setningarfr\u00e6\u00f0i, ver\u00f0ur \u00fe\u00e1 ekki samt \u00feetta sem gerist me\u00f0 hlj\u00f3\u00f0flokkum sem v\u00edsa \u00ed hvora a\u00f0ra og me\u00f0 \u00fev\u00ed a\u00f0 verki\u00f0 hefur heg\u00f0un sem hefur sterk s\u00e9rkenni sem hlustandinn f\u00e6r \u00e1 tilfinninguna, jafnvel \u00fe\u00f3 \u00fea\u00f0 s\u00e9 ekki alveg h\u00e6gt a\u00f0 giska \u00e1 hva\u00f0 gerist n\u00e6st.<\/p><\/div>\n<\/td>\n<\/tr>\n<\/tbody>\n<\/table>\n<\/div>\n<div>\n<div>\n<div>\n<div><a href=\"http:\/\/s-l-a-t-u-r.2169095.n2.nabble.com\/template\/NamlServlet.jtp?macro=user_nodes&amp;user=tervel-3146947%7EDavid+Brynjar+Franzson\">David Brynjar Franzson<\/a><\/div>\n<div><img decoding=\"async\" loading=\"lazy\" title=\"Selected post\" src=\"http:\/\/s-l-a-t-u-r.2169095.n2.nabble.com\/images\/arrow.png\" alt=\"Selected post\" width=\"15\" height=\"15\" \/> Mar 11, 2009; 1:05pm<script type=\"text\/javascript\">\/\/ <![CDATA[\/\/ <![CDATA[\n\t\tNabble.get('d1236776756425-318').innerHTML= Nabble.formatDateLong(new Date(1236776756425));\n\n\/\/ ]]><\/script><\/p>\n<h2>Re: Tungum\u00e1l\/uppl\u00fdsingar og skynjun<\/h2>\n<\/div>\n<div><a rel=\"nofollow\" href=\"http:\/\/s-l-a-t-u-r.2169095.n2.nabble.com\/template\/NamlServlet.jtp?macro=reply&amp;node=2461221\">Reply<\/a> | \t\t\t\t\t<a onclick=\"Nabble.setView('threaded', '\/Tungumal-uppl-singar-og-skynjun-tt2445110.html#a2461221',null)\" href=\"javascript:void(0)\">Threaded<\/a> | \t\t\t\t\t<a title=\"Click for more options\" href=\"javascript:void(0)\">More<\/a> <img decoding=\"async\" loading=\"lazy\" title=\"Click for more options\" src=\"http:\/\/s-l-a-t-u-r.2169095.n2.nabble.com\/images\/more.png\" alt=\"\" width=\"10\" height=\"10\" \/><\/p>\n<table>\n<tbody>\n<tr 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\/><\/div>\n<\/div>\n<\/div>\n<table>\n<tbody>\n<tr>\n<td>\n<div>\n<div><a title=\"View profile of David Brynjar Franzson\" rel=\"nofollow\" href=\"http:\/\/s-l-a-t-u-r.2169095.n2.nabble.com\/template\/NamlServlet.jtp?macro=user_nodes&amp;user=tervel-3146947%7EDavid+Brynjar+Franzson\"><img decoding=\"async\" loading=\"lazy\" title=\"David Brynjar Franzson\" src=\"http:\/\/n2.nabble.com\/images\/avatar100.png\" alt=\"David Brynjar Franzson\" width=\"100\" height=\"100\" \/><img decoding=\"async\" title=\"User is online\" src=\"http:\/\/s-l-a-t-u-r.2169095.n2.nabble.com\/images\/online.png\" alt=\"online\" \/><\/a><\/div>\n<\/div>\n<\/td>\n<td>\n<div>\u00c9g get n\u00fa alveg svara\u00f0 \u00feessu, allavega a\u00f0 mestu.<\/p>\n<p>\u00deegar \u00e9g segi a\u00f0 \u00e9g hafi ekki \u00e1huga \u00e1 uppbyggingu tungum\u00e1ls \u00fe\u00e1 er \u00e9g \u00ed raun a\u00f0 reyna a\u00f0 r\u00e9ttl\u00e6ta \u00fea\u00f0 a\u00f0 r\u00e6\u00f0a um kerfi\u00f0 sem symbol\u00edskt kerfi en ekki sem tungum\u00e1l, sem sagt a\u00f0 loka \u00e1 einn skilning \u00e1 \u00fev\u00ed sem \u00e9g er a\u00f0 fara a\u00f0 r\u00e6\u00f0a til \u00feess a\u00f0 f\u00f3lk taki \u00fev\u00ed ekki bara sem m\u00e1lfr\u00e6\u00f0i p\u00e6lingu. \u00c9g er \u00fear l\u00edka a\u00f0 v\u00edsa til \u00feess a\u00f0 sum verkin eru meira um samhengi t\u00e1kna, i.e. hvernig samhengi myndast e\u00f0a bara hreinlega mismunandi samhengi, og hva\u00f0a \u00e1hrif \u00feetta samhengi hefur \u00e1 hva\u00f0 ma\u00f0ur heyrir og hvernig ma\u00f0ur heyrir \u00fea\u00f0. Viss hlj\u00f3\u00f0 falla \u00ed eina categor\u00edu \u00ed einu samhengi en \u00ed a\u00f0ra categor\u00edu \u00ed \u00f6\u00f0ru samhengi. Ef \u00e9g hef\u00f0i \u00e1huga \u00e1 a\u00f0 byggja tungum\u00e1l \u00fe\u00e1 yr\u00f0i \u00feetta a\u00f0 vera miki\u00f0 kerfisbundnara. \u00cd augnablikinu er \u00e9g me\u00f0 eitthva\u00f0 noise input sem \u00e9g s\u00ed\u00f0an br\u00f3dera utan \u00e1 me\u00f0 \u00fev\u00ed a\u00f0 skilgreina heg\u00f0un\/a\u00f0st\u00e6\u00f0ur og l\u00e1ta \u00fe\u00e6r svo gerast \u00fear sem m\u00e9r finnst \u00fe\u00e6r passa. \u00c9g nota \u00feessar a\u00f0st\u00e6\u00f0ur eiginlega sem categor\u00edska resonatora. Fyrir viki\u00f0 er \u00e9g ekki a\u00f0 einbeyta m\u00e9r a\u00f0 \u00fev\u00ed a\u00f0 vinna me\u00f0 tungum\u00e1lahugsunina heldur hvernig \u00e9g fer a\u00f0 \u00fev\u00ed a\u00f0 gera abstract resonatora sem breg\u00f0ast vi\u00f0 hinu og \u00feessu \u00ed t\u00f3nlistinni. \u00dea\u00f0 getur vel veri\u00f0 a\u00f0 einhver tungum\u00e1lsheg\u00f0un ver\u00f0i til, s\u00e9r \u00ed lagi \u00ed the Failure of Surface sem greinin fjallar um, einmitt \u00ed gegnum categor\u00edu skiptinguna, en \u00fea\u00f0 er algj\u00f6rlega hli\u00f0arframlei\u00f0sla af vinnua\u00f0fer\u00f0inni. Dj\u00f3ki\u00f0 er hvernig surface-i\u00f0 er simulacrum af t\u00f3nlist sem hlj\u00f3mar eins og t\u00f3nlist, \u00ed gegnum \u00fea\u00f0 eitt a\u00f0 resonera \u00e1 \u00feennan h\u00e1tt inputti\u00f0. Tungum\u00e1lsheg\u00f0unin \u00ed \u00feessum stykkjum er algj\u00f6rlega accidental afur\u00f0 \u00feess sem inn\u00ed \u00fea\u00f0 fer. G\u00f3\u00f0 \u00fatsk\u00fdring f\u00e6st me\u00f0 \u00fev\u00ed a\u00f0 skrifa &#8220;define: reductionism&#8221; \u00ed google.<\/p>\n<p>En til a\u00f0 svara \u00fe\u00e9r n\u00e1kv\u00e6mlega, \u00fe\u00e1:<\/p>\n<p>A. Nei. Vinnua\u00f0fer\u00f0in og forma\u00f0fer\u00f0in kemur \u00far \u00feessum tveim t\u00f3nsk\u00e1ldum a\u00f0 st\u00f3ru leyti, e\u00f0a \u00far \u00feeirra hugmyndum. \u00deetta bara \u00e1 ekki vi\u00f0 um t\u00f3nsm\u00ed\u00f0an\u00e1lgunina, getur vel \u00e1tt vi\u00f0 um \u00fatkomuna.<\/p>\n<p>B. Sj\u00e1 h\u00e9r a\u00f0 ofan.<\/p>\n<p>C. \u00dea\u00f0 er n\u00e1kv\u00e6mlega \u00e6tlunin, en n\u00e1lgunin er a\u00f0 hafa kannski 4 \u00feumalputtareglur og heg\u00f0un, og svo konsisant inp\u00fat og konsistant generatora fyrir rhythma og sl\u00edkt. \u00dear me\u00f0 ver\u00f0ur til rosalega t\u00f3nlistarlegt yfirbor\u00f0. Gott d\u00e6mi er rafverki\u00f0 Monday Morning. \u00dear eru sex hlj\u00f3\u00f0generatorar sem \u00e1 einhvernh\u00e1tt taka inn \u00ed sig mismunandi aspect af uppt\u00f6ku sem er \u00ed gangi undir verkinu. Allt sem \u00e9g ger\u00f0i var a\u00f0 forma \u00feessa generatora og hva\u00f0a aspect af hlj\u00f3\u00f0inu feeda\u00f0i inn \u00ed \u00fe\u00e1, og svo deila \u00feeim \u00fat yfir stykk\u00f0 \u00feannig a\u00f0 einn er virku fr\u00e1 0 &#8211; .6, n\u00e6sti .1 &#8211; .7 af lengdinni, etc. \u00deannig eru allir virkir \u00ed kringum c.a. mi\u00f0punkt verksins. \u00datkoman er eins og \u00e9g hafi seti\u00f0 og sami\u00f0 hverja einustu n\u00f3tu \u00fat fr\u00e1 einhverri svakalega subject\u00edfri a\u00f0fer\u00f0, \u00e1 me\u00f0an sannleikurinn er s\u00e1 a\u00f0 \u00e9g bara bj\u00f3 til heg\u00f0unina (dr\u00f3n, tif, h\u00e6kkandi, etc.) og t\u00f3k upp hlj\u00f3\u00f0i\u00f0, og setti svo saman. Ekki neitt subject\u00edft nema vali\u00f0 \u00e1 noise inputti og hva\u00f0a r\u00f6\u00f0 \u00e9g l\u00e9t generatorana fyrst kveikja og svo sl\u00f6kkva \u00e1 s\u00e9r. Allt anna\u00f0, sem sagt \u00f6ll mikr\u00f3heg\u00f0un og l\u00f3ka form, kemur \u00far \u00feessari einf\u00f6ldu heg\u00f0un. Ekki neitt tungum\u00e1lslegt \u00fear held \u00e9g en \u00fatkoman er bullandi rhetor\u00edk.<\/p><\/div>\n<\/td>\n<\/tr>\n<\/tbody>\n<\/table>\n<\/div>\n<div>\n<div>\n<div>\n<div><a href=\"http:\/\/s-l-a-t-u-r.2169095.n2.nabble.com\/template\/NamlServlet.jtp?macro=user_nodes&amp;user=tervel-2900087%7EGu%C3%B0mundur+Steinn+Gunnarsson\">Gu\u00f0mundur Steinn Gunnarsson<\/a><\/div>\n<div><img decoding=\"async\" loading=\"lazy\" title=\"Selected post\" src=\"http:\/\/s-l-a-t-u-r.2169095.n2.nabble.com\/images\/arrow.png\" alt=\"Selected post\" width=\"15\" height=\"15\" \/> Mar 29, 2009; 6:44pm<script type=\"text\/javascript\">\/\/ <![CDATA[\/\/ <![CDATA[\n\t\tNabble.get('d1238352247219-853').innerHTML= Nabble.formatDateLong(new Date(1238352247219));\n\n\/\/ ]]><\/script><\/p>\n<h2>Re: Tungum\u00e1l\/uppl\u00fdsingar og skynjun<\/h2>\n<\/div>\n<div><a rel=\"nofollow\" href=\"http:\/\/s-l-a-t-u-r.2169095.n2.nabble.com\/template\/NamlServlet.jtp?macro=reply&amp;node=2553609\">Reply<\/a> | 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\/><\/div>\n<\/div>\n<\/div>\n<table>\n<tbody>\n<tr>\n<td>\n<div>\n<div><a title=\"View profile of Gu\u00f0mundur Steinn Gunnarsson\" rel=\"nofollow\" href=\"http:\/\/s-l-a-t-u-r.2169095.n2.nabble.com\/template\/NamlServlet.jtp?macro=user_nodes&amp;user=tervel-2900087%7EGu%C3%B0mundur+Steinn+Gunnarsson\"><img decoding=\"async\" loading=\"lazy\" title=\"Gu\u00f0mundur Steinn Gunnarsson\" src=\"http:\/\/n2.nabble.com\/images\/avatar100.png\" alt=\"Gu\u00f0mundur Steinn Gunnarsson\" width=\"100\" height=\"100\" \/><img decoding=\"async\" title=\"User is online\" src=\"http:\/\/s-l-a-t-u-r.2169095.n2.nabble.com\/images\/online.png\" alt=\"online\" \/><\/a><\/div>\n<\/div>\n<\/td>\n<td>\n<div>fallegt. Margar hli\u00f0ar red\u00faskj\u00f3nisma. \u00deegar \u00fe\u00fa segjir &#8220;categ\u00f3r\u00edskir res\u00f3natorar&#8221; \u00e1ttu \u00fe\u00e1 vi\u00f0 a\u00f0 \u00feegar v\u00e9lin heyrir &#8220;j\u00e1, svona gaur&#8221; \u00ed noise inputtinu \u00fe\u00e1 svarar h\u00fan me\u00f0 a\u00f0 setja af sta\u00f0 hlj\u00f3\u00f0kategor\u00edu sem samsvarar heg\u00f0uninni? Sem \u00ed tilfelli Monday Morning er upphr\u00e6rsla af noise inputtinu (noh?) og \u00ed t.d. Failure of Surface eru \u00fea\u00f0 \u00feessar gr\u00f3fu hlj\u00f3\u00f0akateg\u00f3r\u00edur sem eiga s\u00e9r einstakt tilfelli fyrir hvert hlj\u00f3\u00f0f\u00e6ri? Er \u00e9g a\u00f0 skilja \u00feig r\u00e9tt, sem og, skilur\u00f0u hva\u00f0 \u00e9g er a\u00f0 segja?<\/div>\n<\/td>\n<\/tr>\n<\/tbody>\n<\/table>\n<\/div>\n<div>\n<div>\n<div>\n<div><a href=\"http:\/\/s-l-a-t-u-r.2169095.n2.nabble.com\/template\/NamlServlet.jtp?macro=user_nodes&amp;user=tervel-2900087%7EGu%C3%B0mundur+Steinn+Gunnarsson\">Gu\u00f0mundur Steinn Gunnarsson<\/a><\/div>\n<div><img decoding=\"async\" loading=\"lazy\" title=\"Selected post\" src=\"http:\/\/s-l-a-t-u-r.2169095.n2.nabble.com\/images\/arrow.png\" alt=\"Selected post\" width=\"15\" height=\"15\" \/> Apr 07, 2009; 4:39pm<script type=\"text\/javascript\">\/\/ <![CDATA[\/\/ <![CDATA[\n\t\tNabble.get('d1239122363213-152').innerHTML= Nabble.formatDateLong(new Date(1239122363213));\n\n\/\/ ]]><\/script><\/p>\n<h2>Re: Tungum\u00e1l\/uppl\u00fdsingar og skynjun<\/h2>\n<\/div>\n<div><a rel=\"nofollow\" href=\"http:\/\/s-l-a-t-u-r.2169095.n2.nabble.com\/template\/NamlServlet.jtp?macro=reply&amp;node=2600014\">Reply<\/a> 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